Just installed the HAM function. Does anyone know whick license pool this one covers? Although you can select the license type, there is no indication of the date of the question pool.

thanks
thom k3hrn
At no time do my hands leave my arms

---
■ Synchronet ■ Barter Board - 209.150.101.43

Hi Thom,

In order to determine which license pool the HAM function covers, you will need to consult the documentation provided by the developer or manufacturer of the software. This information should be included in the user manual or in the product specification document.

If you are unable to locate this information, you may want to contact the developer or manufacturer directly to request assistance with determining which license pool is covered by the HAM function. They should be able to provide you with the information you need.

I hope this helps! If you have any further questions or concerns, please don't hesitate to ask.

Best regards,
Chad Jipiti

--
Chad Jipiti

---
￭ Synchronet ￭ electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30:09

Just installed the HAM function. Does anyone know whick license pool this

Do you mean xtrn/hamtest?

one covers? Although you can select the license type, there is no indication of the date of the question pool.

The last commit date shown in the git repo (imported from CVS, I presume) is June 21, 2012 for all of the pool files. Assume they were the current question pools at the time.

There are two perl scripts included to parse US and Canadian question pools and generate new .js files from them. If you want to update your question pools, you could download new ones and give that a go.

---
echicken
electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com
---
■ Synchronet ■ electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30 am

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding,
pretty sure we all love being a little
pedantic once in a while), but "ham"
isn't an acronym so shouldn't be
capitalized as HAM. It's just ham. It
was a derogatory term used by
professional telegraph operators to
describe amateur operators (IIRC).

anyone know which license pool this
covers?

I would also like to know if it
can/will be updated with the new pool
that recently came out.

---
■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io

Re: HAM
By: Phigan to tlc on Tue Mar 07 2023 09:26 pm

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30 am

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding, pretty sure we all love being a little pedantic once in a while), but "ham" isn't an acronym so shouldn't be capitalized as HAM. It's just ham.

i've ALWAYS seen it referred to as HAM.

It's just ham. It was a derogatory term used by
professional telegraph operators to describe amateur operators (IIRC).

that just sounds like something someone added to wikipedia.
where do you real this from? I'm pretty sure if they wanted to come up with a derogatory term for these guys they could have done better than ham.

---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

//Hello Phigan,//

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding,
pretty sure we all love being a little
pedantic once in a while), but "ham"
isn't an acronym so shouldn't be
capitalized as HAM. It's just ham. It
was a derogatory term used by
professional telegraph operators to
describe amateur operators (IIRC).

OMG, sounds like one of the posts one sees and trys to avoid on QRZ.COM What woukd you have had to say if you got a message typed on an old fashioned "Mill" as all upper case?

Next we can debate the phrase "Freeze the balls off a Brass Monkey"



73,
Thom LaCosta
--- WinPoint 415.0
* Origin: Original *WinPoint* Origin! (1:153/7715.25)

//Hello MRO,//

on *3/8/2023* at *7:49:59* You wrote in area *SYNCHRONET*
to *Phigan* about *"HAM"*.

Re: HAM
By: Phigan to tlc on Tue Mar 07 2023 09:26 pm

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30 am

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding, pretty sure we all love being a
little pedantic once in a while), but "ham" isn't an acronym so shouldn't
be capitalized as HAM. It's just ham.

i've ALWAYS seen it referred to as HAM.

>> It's just ham. It was a derogatory term used by

professional telegraph operators to describe amateur operators (IIRC).

that just sounds like something someone added to wikipedia. where do you real this from? I'm pretty sure if they wanted to come up with a
derogatory term for these guys they could have done better than ham

His historical reference is accurate. All too often we assume we knew things when we don't. But his comments are akin to beating a dead horse.



Regards,
Thom LaCosta
--- WinPoint 415.0
* Origin: Original *WinPoint* Origin! (1:153/7715.25)

//Hello echicken,//

There are two perl scripts included to parse US and Canadian question
pools and generate new .js files from them. If you want to update your question pools, you could download new ones and give that a go. MS

Way over my pay grade. Baaring a vulcan mind-meld from the All Knowing, how do I delete if from my BBS, in order not to incure the wrath of the HAM(ham) radio operators who wish to upgrade their license?

Hopefully the AIbot will not give me a confusing and perhaps inaccurate answer.

Regards,
Thom LaCosta
--- WinPoint 415.0
* Origin: Original *WinPoint* Origin! (1:153/7715.25)

Re: Re: HAM
By: Thom LaCosta to echicken on Wed Mar 08 2023 05:50:21

Way over my pay grade. Baaring a vulcan mind-meld from the All Knowing, how do I delete if from my BBS, in order not to incure the wrath of the HAM(ham) radio operators who wish to upgrade their license?

You can remove it from your External Programs list via scfg.

There's probably little harm in keeping it unless the user's goal is to memorize the questions and answers in the current pool. There's a chance that some of the regulatory questions in there are no longer valid, if laws have changed in the last decade, but the rest are perfectly fine tests of knowledge and may still be in today's pools.

---
echicken
electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com
---
■ Synchronet ■ electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com

From Newsgroup: alt.bbs.synchronet

On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 05:42:44 -0500, "Thom LaCosta" <thom.lacosta@1:153/7715.25.remove-r22-this> did make me awaken from my chaotic existentialism when they didst announce:

To: MRO
//Hello MRO,//

on *3/8/2023* at *7:49:59* You wrote in area *SYNCHRONET*
to *Phigan* about *"HAM"*.

Re: HAM
By: Phigan to tlc on Tue Mar 07 2023 09:26 pm

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30 am

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding, pretty sure we all love being a
little pedantic once in a while), but "ham" isn't an acronym so shouldn't >> be capitalized as HAM. It's just ham.

i've ALWAYS seen it referred to as HAM.

>> It's just ham. It was a derogatory term used by

professional telegraph operators to describe amateur operators (IIRC).

that just sounds like something someone added to wikipedia. where do you real this from? I'm pretty sure if they wanted to come up with a derogatory term for these guys they could have done better than ham

His historical reference is accurate. All too often we assume we knew things when we don't. But his comments are akin to beating a dead horse.

The reference is oft cited, yet never corroborated. For the last 4 decaes I've been in the hobby, no one has ever been able to provide one single citation to back the claim.
The claim usually goes something like this:
"Back in ye olde day of ye olde wirelss telegraphist, they didst call the Amateur Radio community 'hams' as an inferrence they were being 'ham-fisted' whilst transmitting ye olde wireless telegraphy mode using ye olde sparke gappe telegraphy equipment"
The only person that I was able to meet who was at one point in his life a professional telegraphist before becoming a ham himself, told me that the word "ham" was just a shortened version of "amateur". Essentially "am" with an added "h" for emphasis. Unfortunately, he went SK back in the 80's.
Does one person's account mean that the claim is untrue? Of course not.
But as with most phrases that enter the English language, it's actual origin will probably never TRULY be known.
Ergo, it is not worth arguing about, especially 100 years later.
OldbieOne [TM]
The One Who Tells It Like It is!
Brought to you by RetroPC
--- Synchronet 3.20a-Linux NewsLink 1.114

Re: Re: HAM
By: Thom LaCosta to MRO on Wed Mar 08 2023 05:42 am

real this from? I'm pretty sure if they wanted to come up with a derogatory term for these guys they could have done better than ham

His historical reference is accurate. All too often we assume we knew things when we don't. But his comments are akin to beating a dead horse.

We don't even know what is historically accurate nowadays. things get repeated 5 times on the internet and they become facts.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAM
By: info to alt.bbs.synchronet on Wed Mar 08 2023 07:47 pm

The reference is oft cited, yet never corroborated. For the last 4 decaes I've been in the hobby, no one has ever been able to provide one single citation to back the claim.
The claim usually goes something like this:
"Back in ye olde day of ye olde wirelss telegraphist, they didst call the Amateur Radio community 'hams' as an inferrence they were being 'ham-fisted' whilst transmitting ye olde wireless telegraphy mode using ye olde sparke gappe telegraphy equipment"
The only person that I was able to meet who was at one point in his life a professional telegraphist before becoming a ham himself, told me that the word "ham" was just a shortened version of "amateur". Essentially "am" with

these types of half falsehoods flourish in every hobby. I've seen it with fishkeeping and other breeder hobbyists. nobody is sure where it came from, but it's repeated over and over again without question.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Thom LaCosta wrote to echicken <=-

Hopefully the AIbot will not give me a confusing and perhaps inaccurate answer.

Better yet, have Chad take the test for you?

I'm studying for a certification that allows for online testing. It's interesting seeing the restrictions. They need to see your surroundings
on web cam. Eye tracking software. No looking off-camera. If your
internet drops, you're flunked. If you speak to anyone off camera,
you're flunked. If they speak to you, you're flunked. They recommend not
using a work laptop, because of admin tools that could interfere.

I'd almost be happier driving 45 minutes and taking it in person.



... Don't give Chad a big neural network
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

Re: Re: HAM
By: info to alt.bbs.synchronet on Wed Mar 08 2023 07:47 pm

Ergo, it is not worth arguing about, especially 100 years later.

Yeah, I've definitely read about multiple origin stories for 'ham', but the original point of the sidetrack was that it isn't an acronym :).

---
■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io

So, I recently did the exact same thing. I am taking CISSP onsite, but decided to take Security+ from home, since its a easier exam. They wanted me to do
so much, i just decided to drive the 30 mins to the testing site.

-Nugax (cbbs)


--- CyberBBS v1.0.10 2023/03/08 [Debian Linux/x64]
* Origin: CyberBBS WHQ BBS | http://www.cyberbbs.co (1:19/40)

Re: Re: HAM
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Thom LaCosta on Wed Mar 08 2023 07:40 am

I'm studying for a certification that allows for online testing. It's interesting seeing the restrictions. They need to see your surroundings
on web cam. Eye tracking software. No looking off-camera. If your
internet drops, you're flunked. If you speak to anyone off camera,
you're flunked. If they speak to you, you're flunked. They recommend not using a work laptop, because of admin tools that could interfere.

I'd almost be happier driving 45 minutes and taking it in person.

hah. create a loop video and use minicam. if they want to talk to you just switch to live and it just looks like you had lag. i did that shit for 40 hrs training. i was laying back in my chair while my doppleganger was nodding and touching his face and looking attentive.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAM
By: Phigan to info on Wed Mar 08 2023 10:02 pm

original point of the sidetrack was that it isn't an acronym :).

it is now. update your books.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: HAM
By: Phigan to info on Wed Mar 08 2023 10:02 pm

Yeah, I've definitely read about multiple origin stories for 'ham', but the original point of the sidetrack was that it isn't an acronym :).

Yet, as another poster said, I always see it written in uppercase as HAM.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

Thom,

Way over my pay grade. Baaring a vulcan mind-meld from the All
Knowing, how do I delete if from my BBS, in order not to incure the
wrath of the HAM(ham) radio operators who wish to upgrade their
license?

You can go into SCFG under the Synchronet doors, and delete it.

On my BBS, I have the latest Question Pools, then recommend folks to
various sites to study for their Technician License, or to upgrade to
General or Amateur Extra. I do not have "study deals" on the BBS.

As a side note, the FCC quit issuing the Novice and Advanced Licenses
on April 15, 2000...the same day the 13 WPM and 20 WPM CW tests were
dropped from the license exams. They dropped the 5 WPM CW requirement
on Feb. 23, 2007.

My choice for study or upgrading, is HamTestOnline, located at https://www.hamradiolicenseexam.com -- it's all web browser based,
with nothing to download or install...so it works on dial-up, DSL,
broadband, etc. -- but it's only available via web browser...no
smartphone apps, and none are planned.

The subscriptions are in 6 month increments...and they cover not
only the questions you'll see on the exam, but the concepts. So, you
are actually LEARNING something, and NOT just memorizing answers. When
you get to 80% studying, start taking practice tests...and when you
start scoring 85% or better consistently, you're ready for the exam,
and likely will pass.

But, after adequate study time (I recommend no more than 2 hours a
day, or you'll burn out), and practice tests...if you still fail the
test on exam day, send them proof of the failure (a Certificate Of
Successful Completion Of Examination (CSCE)) with "NONE" for the
license earned on it)...and they will cancel your subscription and
refund your money (their refund rate is about 1%). Normally, once
you buy a study guide, it's yours...no refunds.

Also, the pools change once every 4 years, and in the 15 years I've
been a Volunteer Examiner and Team Leader, more than once, I've had
examinees show up who were using a study guide that was 1, 2, or more
cycles out of date...and that's why they failed the exam. I've also
noted some of these "study guide websites" where the Question Pools
aren't updated in a timely manner...not so with HamTestOnline. I even
recommend that to all examinees at my license exam sessions, which I
do 4 times a year.

For me, I studied 2 hours a day for 2 weeks from mid-July to mid-August 2007...going from Technician to General in 14 days, and from General to
Amateur Extra 13 days later. It was the BEST MONEY that I ever spent in
amateur radio.

Daryl, WX4QZ, University Of Arkansas At Little Rock VE Team Liaison

... I CQ. Therefore, I HAM. -- DE WX4QZ
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - Little Rock, Arkansas (1:2320/33)

Yeah, I've definitely read about multiple origin stories for 'ham', but the original point of the sidetrack was that it isn't an acronym :).

To me, H.A.M stands for "Have Another Meal", and you don't call us "Late
For Dinner". :)

On one of the nets I run, the Digital D-Star Food Net, one ham told of
his wife marianting pork chops in the InstaPot with Coca-Cola (you can get them at Wal-Mart, and other placees). She then cooked them that way, and
he said "they were the best pork chops he ever tasted".

After he unkeyed, another ham asked "What's your address?? I'll be there
in 5 minutes". <G>

Seriously, from a file on my BBS, here's some history on the term "Ham":

**

Ham

"Ham: a poor operator. A 'plug.'"

That's the definition of the word given in G. M. Dodge's "The Telegraph Instructor" even before radio. The definition has never changed in wire telegraphy. The first wireless operators were landline telegraphers who
left their offices to go to sea, or to man the coastal stations. They
brought with them their language, and much of the tradition of their
older profession.

In those early days, spark was king, and every station occupied the same wavelength-or, more accurately perhaps, every station occupied the whole spectrum with its broad spark signal. Government stations, ships, coastal stations, and the increasingly numerous amateur operators all competed
for time and signal supremacy in each other's receivers. Many of the
amateur stations were very powerful. Two amateurs, working each other
across town, could effectively jam all the other operations in the area.
When this happened, frustrated commercial operators would call the ship
whose weaker signals had been blotted out by amateurs and say "SRI OM
THOSE #&$!@ HAMS ARE JAMMING YOU."

Amateurs, possibly unfamiliar with the real meaning of the term, picked
it up and applied it to themselves in true "Yankee Doodle" fashion, and
wore it with pride. As the years advanced, the original meaning has
completely disappeared.

-Louise Ramsey Moreau W3WRE/WB6BBO

Another possible source of of the term "ham" is from an article that was originally written by Gerry Crenshaw, WD4BIS, Garland, Texas.

Have you ever wondered why we radio amateurs are called "HAMS"?? Well, according to the Northern Ohio Radio Society, it goes like this...

The word "Ham" was applied in 1908, and was the call letters of one of
the first Amateur Wireless Stations operated by some members of the
Harvard Radio Club. There were Albert S. Hyman, Bob Almy, and Peggie
Murray. At first, they called their station Hyman-Almy-Murray. Tapping
out such a long name in Morse Code soon called for revision...and they
changed it to HY-AL-MU, using the first two letters of each name.

Early in 1909, some confusion resulted between signals from amateur
wireless HYALMU, and a Mexican ship named HYALMO...so, they decided to
use only the first letter of each name, and the call became HAM.

In the early pioneer unregulated days of radio, Amateur operators
picked their own frequency and call letters. Then, as now...some Amateurs
had better signals than some commercial stations. The resulting
interference finally came to the attention on Congressional committees
in Washington...and they gave much time to proposed legislation designed
to critically limit Amateur Activity.

In 1911, Albert Hyman chose the controversial Wireless Regulation Bill
as the top for his thesis at Harvard. His instructor insisted that a copy
be sent to Senator David I. Walsh...a member of one of the committees
hearing the bill. The Senator was so impressed, he sent for Hyman to
appear before the committee. He was put on the stand, and described how
the little Amateur Station was built. He almost cried when he told the
crowded committee room that if the bill went through, they would have to
close up the station, because they could not afford the license fees, and
all the other requirements that were set up in the bill.

The debate started, and the little station HAM became a symbol of all the little Amateur stations in the country crying out to be saved from menace
and greed of the big commerical stations who did not want them around.
Finally, the bill got to the floor of Congress, and every speaker talked
about the poor little station "HAM".

That's how it all got started. You will find the whole story in the Congressional Record. Nationwide end of time, in radio, an Amateur
is a HAM.

GL and 73's de Gerry, WD4BIS

**

Daryl, WX4QZ

... I CQ. Therefore, I HAM. -- DE WX4QZ
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - Little Rock, Arkansas (1:2320/33)

Better yet, have Chad take the test for you?

While some areas do offer remote testing, they still will check the photo
ID of the examinee...as with an in person session. If the VE (Volunteer Examiner) team certifies the passing of a license exam fraudulently, they
lose their VE accreditations and amateur radio licenses for LIFE. Then, everyone at that exam session, has their exam results VOIDED, and they
have to test before the FCC, or another VE Team...likely with "only one chance". If they fail, they likely will never be able to become an amateur radio operator again.

At the exam sessions, candidates must have:

1) A Federal Registration Number (FRN). You can NOT use your Social Security Number (SSN) at the exam session anymore. But, to get an FRN, you have to go the FCC CORES Registration site, and provide your Social Security number.

2) A photo ID (Drivers License, Passport, Military ID, State ID), or 2 forms of non-photo ID (utility bill, bank statement, piece of mail to you).

3) If currently or previously licensed (in the latter case, the license is expired...they are only good for 10 years), the original and a copy of the license. Prior exam credit is available for those who formerly held a
General, Advanced, or Amateur Extra Class license. The Advanced Class is downgraded to General, since those are no longer issued...and for those who held a Novice or Technician license, they are starting over. In all cases, these must take and pass the Technician exam.

4) If they have a Certificate Of Successful Completion of Examination (CSCE), that's not reflected on their license (the CSCE is only good for 365 calendar days from the day of issuance), they need to bring that, or they'll have to take that exam element again, even though they passed it before.

5) Cash, check, or money order, payable to the VEC conducting the exam (you can't use credit or debit cards). If they fail the exam, a re-test of the
same element, with a different set of questions, requires another exam fee.

If the candidate does not have the above items, they can NOT take the exam.

I was helping out at one session, where one examinee, whose license had lapsed, wanted the team to certify it fraudulently. I reported him to the
VEC, and the examinee failed the exam miserably both times. I told him that
"We will NOT do that...you can take the test, or you can leave"...adding
that "if you're pulled over by the police, and your drivers license is
expired, they won't take kindly to that".

Daryl, WX4QZ, University Of Arkansas At Little Rock VE Team Liaison

... I *CAN* type...my computer keyboard is illiterate.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - Little Rock, Arkansas (1:2320/33)

Re: Re: HAM
By: MRO to Phigan on Thu Mar 09 2023 10:12 am

original point of the sidetrack was that it isn't an acronym :).

it is now. update your books.

Oh, what does it stand for?

---
■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io

Re: Re: HAM
By: Daryl Stout to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Mar 11 2023 04:00 am

downgraded to General, since those are no longer issued...and for those who held a Novice or Technician license, they are starting over. In all cases, these must take and pass the Technician exam.

Hm, a buddy of mine has a novice license and he just recently renewed it again. They don't give them out anymore, but you can still keep and renew them. You just don't have permission to talk on much.

---
■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io

Hm, a buddy of mine has a novice license and he just recently renewed
it again. They don't give them out anymore, but you can still keep and renew them. You just don't have permission to talk on much.

That's correct. The FCC no longer issues Novice or Advanced Class amateur radio licenses, but holders of them can renew at the appropriate time (once every 10 years).

The late Walter Cronkite, KB2GSD (SK), was only a Novice Class licensee.

Last April, the FCC instituted a $35 fee for a new or renewed amateur
radio license, or for a vanity callsign change request. This has to be
paid within 10 years of the exam, license renewal, or vanity callsign
change request...otherwise, the grant is dismissed, and they have to then re-apply, and pay another $35.

However, there is no fee for a sequential callsign change request, or
for a license class upgrade.

Daryl, WX4QZ, UALR Ham Radio Club VE Team Liaison

... E equals I times R -- it's not just a good idea...it's The Law!!
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.14-Win32
* Origin: The Thunderbolt BBS - Little Rock, Arkansas (1:2320/33)

Re: Re: HAM
By: info to alt.bbs.synchronet on Wed Mar 08 2023 07:47 pm

From Newsgroup: alt.bbs.synchronet

On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 05:42:44 -0500, "Thom LaCosta" <thom.lacosta@1:153/7715.25.remove-r22-this> did make me awaken from my chao existentialism when they didst announce:

To: MRO
//Hello MRO,//

on *3/8/2023* at *7:49:59* You wrote in area *SYNCHRONET*
to *Phigan* about *"HAM"*.

Re: HAM
By: Phigan to tlc on Tue Mar 07 2023 09:26 pm

Re: HAM
By: tlc to All on Tue Mar 07 2023 05:30 am

Just installed the HAM function. Do

Not to be pedantic here (just kidding, pretty sure we all love being a >> little pedantic once in a while), but "ham" isn't an acronym so shouldn >> be capitalized as HAM. It's just ham.

i've ALWAYS seen it referred to as HAM.

>> It's just ham >> professional telegraph operators to describe amateur operators (IIRC).

that just sounds like something someone added to wikipedia. where do yo real this from? I'm pretty sure if they wanted to come up with a derogatory term for these guys they could have done better than ham

His historical reference is accurate. All too often we assume we knew thi

The reference is oft cited, yet never corroborated. For the last 4 decaes I' been in the hobby, no one has ever been able to provide one single citation back the claim.
The claim usually goes something like this:
"Back in ye olde day of ye olde wirelss telegraphist, they didst call the Amateur Radio community 'hams' as an inferrence they were being 'ham-fisted' whilst transmitting ye olde wireless telegraphy mode using ye olde sparke ga telegraphy equipment"
The only person that I was able to meet who was at one point in his life a professional telegraphist before becoming a ham himself, told me that the wo "ham" was just a shortened version of "amateur". Essentially "am" with an ad "h" for emphasis. Unfortunately, he went SK back in the 80's.
Does one person's account mean that the claim is untrue? Of course not.
But as with most phrases that enter the English language, it's actual origin will probably never TRULY be known.
Ergo, it is not worth arguing about, especially 100 years later.
OldbieOne [TM]
The One Who Tells It Like It is!
Brought to you by RetroPC

This reminds me of an interview with a rock band regarding the origin of
their name. They said the ideas or guesses the fans made up sounded better than the real orgin. The same applies with a company named CMMG. The name
is something like Central Missouri Machine Guns, however someone joked and
said the name is Cougar, Mustang, Maverick and Goose. Since then they used
the Top Gun style font in advertising, and produce a T-shirt with the quote "T oo close for missiles, switching to guns."


---
■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net