• Linux Daily?

    From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to All on Thu Jul 25 00:19:24 2019
    This echo is too quiet!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as changing distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while, and end up liking or not liking depending.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop (Mostly secondary computer), and Linux Mint on my primary desktop, however I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or Fedora. Still not sure.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Deon George@3:633/509 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 15:52:07 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to All on Thu Jul 25 2019 12:19 am

    This echo is too quiet!

    It is!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use?

    As a server, I do - but pretty much exclusively with docker now.

    ...δεσπ
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Alterant | An SBBS in Docker on Pi! (3:633/509)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Deon George on Thu Jul 25 02:12:39 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Deon George to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 2019 03:52 pm

    This echo is too quiet!

    It is!

    Let's make some NOISE! ;)

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use?

    As a server, I do - but pretty much exclusively with docker now.

    Hmmm... I don't much particularly like docker so much. I sort of liked the idea of it when they were still using lxc concepts with it, but when they switched to libcontainer, that... That pretty much ended it for me for anything security-minded. Reliability minded too, actually.

    I do use Docker, sometimes, but I keep it limited to development stuff only. Usually testing something, like integration testing for salt states, or chef cookbooks, etc.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Deon George@3:633/509 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 19:19:05 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to Deon George on Thu Jul 25 2019 02:12 am

    Hmmm... I don't much particularly like docker so much. I sort of liked the idea of it when they were still using lxc concepts with it, but when they switched to libcontainer, that... That pretty much ended it for me for anything security-minded. Reliability minded too, actually.

    Oh, that's a shame.

    I'm a huge fan of docker. I like how I can shift stuff around fairly easily, and that I can seperate data (aligned with a specific version of an app) to an application container (of a specific version). It makes it easy to shelve stuff
    and revive it later (or backout of a failed upgrade fairly easily).

    I too develop, on my MAC, so its no effort to get a container running on it, then using that same container on the (production) linux system.

    ...δεσπ
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Alterant | An SBBS in Docker on Pi! (3:633/509)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 18:34:00 2019
    On 07-25-19 00:19, Eric Renfro wrote to All <=-

    This echo is too quiet!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as changing distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or wanting to
    try something different for a while, and end up liking or not liking depending.

    I have at times, but the truth is that some tasks work better on Windows, some work better on Linux, so I run both side by side. Currently, since they're not in the same place, I'm running the Linux apps remotely via an X server on Windows.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop (Mostly secondary computer), and Linux Mint on my primary desktop, however I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or Fedora. Still not sure.

    My Linux desktop runs Mint.


    ... The only things done by Friday are with Robinson Crusoe.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Deon George on Thu Jul 25 18:36:00 2019
    On 07-25-19 15:52, Deon George wrote to Eric Renfro <=-

    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to All on Thu Jul 25 2019 12:19 am

    This echo is too quiet!

    It is!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use?

    As a server, I do - but pretty much exclusively with docker now.

    Oh, for servers, I run exclusively Linux. Desktop is Windows and Linux side by side, with a Lubuntu Linux netbook for travel, which is perfect for mobile BBSing. :)


    ... I must apologise to the deaf for the loss of subtitles. "What?"
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    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Kees van Eeten@2:280/5003.4 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 11:28:28 2019
    Hello Eric!

    25 Jul 19 00:19, you wrote to All:

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use?

    I do. Started with Yggdrasil, but really started with first SLS and
    then Slackware. So I probably started in 1993/94.
    Somebody at work had downloaded the six or eight SLS floppies.

    My last MS systems were Vista and XT, that came preinstalled on a Laptops.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop (Mostly secondary computer), and Linux Mint on my primary desktop, however I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or Fedora. Still not sure.

    Debian and Raspbian here, with some Ubuntu on Laptops, because of less
    stringent use of propriatory software for drivers.

    It is all Debian based, wich makes you feel at home on all systems.
    Apart from one all mainly run headless, installing distributions, with extra
    emphasis on the user interface, on headless servers, is futile.

    Kees

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
    * Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)
  • From Vince Coen@2:250/1 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 11:14:05 2019
    Hello Eric!

    Thursday July 25 2019 00:19, you wrote to All:

    This echo is too quiet!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as changing
    distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or wanting to
    try something different for a while, and end up liking or not liking depending.

    Switched over to Linux when IBM announced OS/2 being discontinued so late 90's may be and first one was Suse, how ever having got annoyed with german words being used a lot in a English version switched to Mandrake, then Mandriva then with next to go work happeing on it switched again to Mageia and now on v6 all on my primary system server, development, bbs, mysql, apache, ftp etc also running along with IBM MVS based operating systems.

    Media system uses Ubuntu (18.04 I think) with Mythtv s/w.

    Laptop Windows 10
    My wife's system uses Win 7 Ultimate (not large enough for Win 10) but more importantly she is used to v7.

    Raspberry Pi 3B+ with USB HDD using the standard distro - mostly for Cobol - Java development as an experiment and as a BBS back up so it runs rsync against
    primary for all MBSE bbs areas four times a day.

    Currently waiting for a X830 USB HDD case and card to be available to update to
    Pi 4B+ 8Gb but would like a sata interface version but that will not happen any
    time soon.

    Still looking for a cheap working IBM Multiverse system for the garage so I can
    run a training / reminder service for fellow ex IBM'ers (Runs on 240 Volts as against 400 three phase). It will also run Linux on one or more LPARs.


    Vince

    --- Mageia Linux v6 X64/Mbse v1.0.7.12/GoldED+/LNX 1.1.501-b20150715
    * Origin: Air Applewood, The Linux Gateway to the UK & Eire (2:250/1)
  • From Paul Quinn@3:640/1384 to Tony Langdon on Thu Jul 25 21:28:03 2019
    Hi! Tony,

    On 25 Jul 19 18:36, you wrote to Deon George:

    Oh, for servers, I run exclusively Linux. Desktop is Windows and
    Linux side by side, with a Lubuntu Linux netbook for travel, which is perfect for mobile BBSing. :)

    Lubuntu runs nicely in a VirtualBox too. Imagine: a Ubuntu GUI running in less
    than 1Gb RAM. Whoo!hoo!

    Cheers,
    Paul.

    ... SysOps just like to watch.
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20130515
    * Origin: Quinn's Rock - Live from Paul's Xubuntu desktop! (3:640/1384)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Paul Quinn on Thu Jul 25 21:46:00 2019
    On 07-25-19 21:28, Paul Quinn wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Lubuntu runs nicely in a VirtualBox too. Imagine: a Ubuntu GUI running
    in less than 1Gb RAM. Whoo!hoo!

    Interesting. :)


    ... Don't drink and park; accidents cause people.
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    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Dan Clough@1:123/115 to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 07:51:00 2019
    Eric Renfro wrote to All <=-

    This echo is too quiet!

    Sure is.

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their
    daily use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through
    thick and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping
    so much as changing distros every now and then when certain
    issues arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while,
    and end up liking or not liking depending.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop
    (Mostly secondary computer), and Linux Mint on my primary
    desktop, however I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or
    Fedora. Still not sure.

    I use only Linux, other than a work laptop that I'm required to
    run Win10 on. A little past the 20 year point too. First ever
    install was Slackware (or maybe SLS, can't remember) from
    floppies... Eventually Redhat when it was still free, then
    Mandrake for a while. Back to Slackware around 2002 or so, and
    been there ever since. I do play around with other distros and am
    familiar with most of them, but Slackware remains my primary (on a
    Lenovo laptop). I also have a few RPi's doing various things,
    mostly running stock Raspbian. The BBS runs on a seperate small
    form factor Dell, also running Slackware.



    ... If it weren't for Edison we'd be using computers by candlelight
    === MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)
  • From Mike Powell@1:2320/105 to ERIC RENFRO on Thu Jul 25 19:54:00 2019
    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use? I've >been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro, >and not really distro hopping so much as changing distros every now and then >when certain issues arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while, >and end up liking or not liking depending.

    At work they are still stuck on windows but all of my home machines have
    some form of debian on them. My laptop and server are debian proper, while
    the two BBS SBCs are ubilinux and raspbian.

    ---
    * SLMR 2.1a * Windows isn't crippleware: it's "Functionally Challenged"
    * Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Deon George on Fri Jul 26 02:23:40 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Deon George to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 2019 07:19 pm

    Hmmm... I don't much particularly like docker so much. I sort of liked
    the idea of it when they were still using lxc concepts with it, but
    when they switched to libcontainer, that... That pretty much ended it
    for me for anything security-minded. Reliability minded too, actually.

    Oh, that's a shame.

    I'm a huge fan of docker. I like how I can shift stuff around fairly easily, and that I can seperate data (aligned with a specific version of an app) to an application container (of a specific version). It makes it easy to shelve stuff and revive it later (or backout of a failed upgrade fairly easily).

    I mean, you can technically do all that without the need for docker or even any kind of complex setup at all. Docker doesn't actually bring anything new there, just more complexity in order to achieve it really.

    I too develop, on my MAC, so its no effort to get a container running on it, then using that same container on the (production) linux system.

    This part, in more recent times anyway, is true, however... There are going to be some unique differences in even that, which is partly a problem. Containers definitely have some universal aspects they can do, and then they also have some that will be hardware/OS different which can (and will) cause issues in certain situations.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Fri Jul 26 02:28:27 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 2019 06:34 pm

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and
    thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as
    changing distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or
    wanting to try something different for a while, and end up liking or
    not liking depending.

    I have at times, but the truth is that some tasks work better on Windows, some work better on Linux, so I run both side by side. Currently, since they're not in the same place, I'm running the Linux apps remotely via an X server on Windows.

    "Better" than what, exactly? ;) Coming from having used Windows 1.0 to Windows 7, OS/2 Warp/Warp Connect, and I forget the OS/2 version that actually supported JFS out of the box, but that version too, various UNIX systems, and of course, Linux and BSD systems.

    I cannot think of a single thing where one actually does something "better" than the other, in any way.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop (Mostly
    secondary computer), and Linux Mint on my primary desktop, however
    I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or Fedora. Still not sure.

    My Linux desktop runs Mint.

    Yeah, I dread the infernal upgrade process which I've heard has been notoriously broken many times over. As in, they've historically never done it right, not like Ubuntu LTS->LTS, or Fedora (since dnf), and of course Debian.

    But, my reasons for using Linux Mint are pretty much ended when Cinnamon started showing me ghosted taskbar items on the taskbar of my secondary display, and the only resolution to solving it was... Logout and back in again. It's very similar to the reason I left KDE, after having used KDE since pre
    1.0 days, all the way through 5.x.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Kees van Eeten on Fri Jul 26 02:34:24 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Kees van Eeten to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 2019 11:28 am

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use?

    I do. Started with Yggdrasil, but really started with first SLS and
    then Slackware. So I probably started in 1993/94.
    Somebody at work had downloaded the six or eight SLS floppies.

    Wow.. Now THAT's a distro I haven't heard a lot of people use. ;) I actually started Linux with SLS, when it was still new. Later went on to Slackware, then I moved into Yggdrasil, and loved the heck out of it. ;)

    My last MS systems were Vista and XT, that came preinstalled on a Laptops.

    That's one of the first things I generally remove, is Windows, from any laptop I buy, and then I go to Microsoft asking for my refund, because I didn't want an actual OS on my laptop, but since I had no real choice in the matter.... hehe

    Debian and Raspbian here, with some Ubuntu on Laptops, because of less stringent use of propriatory software for drivers.

    Nice. I use Raspbian on my RPi 3, which is kind of like the main "HUB" to my entire home automation system at my house that I've been designing and engineering. ;)

    It is all Debian based, wich makes you feel at home on all systems.
    Apart from one all mainly run headless, installing distributions, with extra emphasis on the user interface, on headless servers, is futile.

    Truth be said, I personally never had much actual love of Debian. I like the simplicity of the package format itself, a .deb is basically a GNU ar "archive", with two specifically named tarballs inside it. It's really the debian/* files that annoy me the most about it, and how their repository structures are so convoluted and not-so-straightforward, at all.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Dan Clough on Fri Jul 26 02:41:11 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Dan Clough to Eric Renfro on Thu Jul 25 2019 07:51 am

    I use only Linux, other than a work laptop that I'm required to
    run Win10 on. A little past the 20 year point too. First ever
    install was Slackware (or maybe SLS, can't remember) from
    floppies... Eventually Redhat when it was still free, then
    Mandrake for a while. Back to Slackware around 2002 or so, and
    been there ever since. I do play around with other distros and am familiar with most of them, but Slackware remains my primary (on a
    Lenovo laptop). I also have a few RPi's doing various things,
    mostly running stock Raspbian. The BBS runs on a seperate small
    form factor Dell, also running Slackware.

    Heh. I've actually turned down working for companies, because I always ask one question during an interview. "Will I ever be required to run, operate, configure, manage, or even so much as touch a Windows Desktop, or Windows Server" And "Can I get an actual Linux oriented Workstation?" And I don't mean a PC with Linux on it, I mean an actual workstation. :)

    Slackware never really left me with good feelings. I don't like the minimalistic approach to it, especially the, still lacking, support for Linux-PAM. And the literal dictatorialship of Patrick Volkerding over Slackware is not too intriguing to me either. I respect the distro, being one of the earlier distros out there and still being maintained to this day, but that's about where it ends.. For me anyway.

    But, the good thing about Linux is freedom to choose whatever you want to use, and appreciate it for what it is, and does for you what you want of it. :)

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Mike Powell on Fri Jul 26 02:44:49 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Mike Powell to ERIC RENFRO on Thu Jul 25 2019 07:54 pm

    At work they are still stuck on windows but all of my home machines have some form of debian on them. My laptop and server are debian proper, while the two BBS SBCs are ubilinux and raspbian.

    Heh, as I just mentioned in a previous reply, it's actually one of my specific questions to potential employers during the interview process. If Windows is in any way shape or form a requirement to run as a desktop or handle at any capacity other than maybe very minor things at best... Then I will walk away from the offer without a second thought. ;)

    A co-worker of mine actually uses Debian on their desktop as well. I was surprised to find out than network-manager-l2tp and network-manager-l2tp-gnome wasn't even in any Debian version until Debian 10 (Buster). I mean, it's been out and available, and functional... For years. Granted, L2TP is a royal sack of steaming decrepid..... You get the point, but still. :)

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 19:51:00 2019
    On 07-26-19 02:28, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    I cannot think of a single thing where one actually does something "better" than the other, in any way.

    I disagree, some things work better in some environments, others work better in different environments. One big thing for me is a fairly complex installation of Thunderbird definitely works better in a Linux environment, which can be kept clean and simple, without various antimalware products competing for the CPU's attention, every time mail is scanned. Thunderbird and Windows also experience some odd focus changes that aren't commanded by the click of a mouse. No such issues on Linux.

    On the other side, a lot of ham radio software still requires a Windoes OS. SOme will run under WINE, but not all of them will work that way.

    Yeah, I dread the infernal upgrade process which I've heard has been notoriously broken many times over. As in, they've historically never
    done it right, not like Ubuntu LTS->LTS, or Fedora (since dnf), and of course Debian.

    But, my reasons for using Linux Mint are pretty much ended when
    Cinnamon started showing me ghosted taskbar items on the taskbar of my secondary display, and the only resolution to solving it was... Logout
    and back in again. It's very similar to the reason I left KDE, after having used KDE since pre 1.0 days, all the way through 5.x.

    Hmm, never had that issue at least, not yet.


    ... Bit: The increment by which programmers slowly go mad
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 19:59:00 2019
    On 07-26-19 02:34, Eric Renfro wrote to Kees van Eeten <=-

    Wow.. Now THAT's a distro I haven't heard a lot of people use. ;) I actually started Linux with SLS, when it was still new. Later went on
    to Slackware, then I moved into Yggdrasil, and loved the heck out of
    it. ;)

    I started with Yggdrasil (back when 1.2.13 was the latest and greatest kernel).
    The version I had was buggy in a few respects, expexially with some of the bundled GUI utilities. I switched to Slackware, which I found very solid, then went to Red Hat (and its descendents) for many years, before moving mainly to Debian and Debian based distros (Mint, Lubuntu, Raspian, etc) in more recent years.


    ... If you do a favor, forget it. If you receive a favor, remember it.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
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  • From Dan Clough@1:123/115 to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 08:35:00 2019
    Eric Renfro wrote to Dan Clough <=-

    I use only Linux, other than a work laptop that I'm required to
    run Win10 on. A little past the 20 year point too. First ever
    install was Slackware (or maybe SLS, can't remember) from
    floppies... Eventually Redhat when it was still free, then
    Mandrake for a while. Back to Slackware around 2002 or so, and
    been there ever since. I do play around with other distros and am
    familiar with most of them, but Slackware remains my primary (on a
    Lenovo laptop). I also have a few RPi's doing various things,
    mostly running stock Raspbian. The BBS runs on a seperate small
    form factor Dell, also running Slackware.

    Heh. I've actually turned down working for companies, because I
    always ask one question during an interview. "Will I ever be
    required to run, operate, configure, manage, or even so much as
    touch a Windows Desktop, or Windows Server" And "Can I get an
    actual Linux oriented Workstation?" And I don't mean a PC with
    Linux on it, I mean an actual workstation. :)

    Hehe, nice, unless...... it means you don't get the job. LOL

    Slackware never really left me with good feelings. I don't like
    the minimalistic approach to it, especially the, still lacking,
    support for Linux-PAM. And the literal dictatorialship of Patrick Volkerding over Slackware is not too intriguing to me either. I
    respect the distro, being one of the earlier distros out there
    and still being maintained to this day, but that's about where it
    ends.. For me anyway.

    Well, yes, it doesn't have many of the flashy GUI-configgy things
    that are common nowadays, but once you know your way around it's
    just as easy. Patrick calls himself a "benevolent dictator". :-)
    As far as I know, it is *THE* oldest surviving distro today.

    But, the good thing about Linux is freedom to choose whatever you
    want to use, and appreciate it for what it is, and does for you
    what you want of it. :)

    Indeed. The essence of Linux, right there.



    ... Internal Error: The system has been taken over by sheep at line 19960
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  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Sat Jul 27 13:46:01 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 2019 07:51 pm

    I cannot think of a single thing where one actually does something
    "better" than the other, in any way.

    I disagree, some things work better in some environments, others work better in different environments. One big thing for me is a fairly complex installation of Thunderbird definitely works better in a Linux environment, which can be kept clean and simple, without various antimalware products competing for the CPU's attention, every time mail is scanned. Thunderbird and Windows also experience some odd focus changes that aren't commanded by the click of a mouse. No such issues on Linux.

    Hmmmm... I mean, the imposed requirements of even having to have "antivirus" software specifically is pretty much degrading even the chances of having "better" in the vocabulary at all when it comes to Windows. The fact you have to have something like that constantly running just to prevent both infection and spreading alone...

    Focus changes, minor things, in my book. And that can always vary, even in Linux, based on what Desktop Environment or window-manager you use. :)

    On the other side, a lot of ham radio software still requires a Windoes OS. SOme will run under WINE, but not all of them will work that way.

    Hmm.. Never done HAM stuff, so I can't really comment on that. I have done nodal networking techniques with various things, and could digress to say that the difference between HAM packets and other forms of network packets over radio waves can definitely vary significantly. Especially in security aspects, and since it's over the air, security is highly important in my book.

    But, my reasons for using Linux Mint are pretty much ended when
    Cinnamon started showing me ghosted taskbar items on the taskbar of
    my secondary display, and the only resolution to solving it was...

    Hmm, never had that issue at least, not yet.

    For me, it started being a real issue around Cinnamon 4.x, when it really started to get unstable. I've gone to using my old trusty XFCE which has never let me down. Unlike KDE, Gnome, Cinnamon, and pretty much everything else to date actually, in terms of DE's.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Sat Jul 27 13:54:40 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 2019 07:59 pm

    I started with Yggdrasil (back when 1.2.13 was the latest and greatest kernel).
    The version I had was buggy in a few respects, expexially with some of the bundled GUI utilities. I switched to Slackware, which I found very solid, then went to Red Hat (and its descendents) for many years, before moving mainly to Debian and Debian based distros (Mint, Lubuntu, Raspian, etc) in more recent years.

    Heh yeah. It's funny, for me, I hated Red Hat back then. I actually had preferred Debian and actually more than that, I preferred SUSE. I think ultimately what I'm going to end up with is either sticking hard on Fedora, which I've actually liked since Fedora 18 and up, or with Xubuntu, which I hate trying to maintain packages for, and do need to for a small few things (SyncTERM for example)... It really depends. There's a few things I definitely really must have, and that's reasonably up-to-date browsers, reasonably up-to-date video driver support, moderate printer support (I currently have a semi-modern HP printer which requires a minimum version of hpcups to use it, which was not in Ubuntu 16.04), and some specific programs like zssh. Because, I like my zmodem over ssh, which I miss with not having konsole from KDE.

    Now, I'd mentioned SUSE, but not in current days. openSUSE has let me down way too much in the later years. With a lot of their dirty little hacks, like their "Druid" replacement for virt-manager's VM "Wizard", which they only fairly recently finally removed after all these years. Their default setup for open-files limit which breaks any modern browser today, and just.... their reliance on btrfs for things like snapshots and the ability to roll back changes, stuff that yum and dnf had had without filesystem level snapshots for years.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Dan Clough on Sat Jul 27 14:02:01 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Dan Clough to Eric Renfro on Fri Jul 26 2019 08:35 am

    Heh. I've actually turned down working for companies, because I
    always ask one question during an interview. "Will I ever be
    required to run, operate, configure, manage, or even so much as
    touch a Windows Desktop, or Windows Server" And "Can I get an
    actual Linux oriented Workstation?" And I don't mean a PC with
    Linux on it, I mean an actual workstation. :)

    Hehe, nice, unless...... it means you don't get the job. LOL

    I mean, it does mean that I will actively turn down jobs in situations like that. But in my case, I can afford to be picky and specific. I get 5~10 offers for work every week. More during the prime times of January and July, where lots of companies do their biggest hiring hunts.

    Well, yes, it doesn't have many of the flashy GUI-configgy things
    that are common nowadays, but once you know your way around it's
    just as easy. Patrick calls himself a "benevolent dictator". :-)
    As far as I know, it is *THE* oldest surviving distro today.

    Yepperding. All bow to Patrick Volkerding, supre.... Nope. Not me! LOL. But yes, it is one of the oldest. But then again, So is Debian, Red Hat Linux, and openSUSE still, runners up from Slackware at least. openSUSE was originally based on SLS and then rebased off Slackware.

    Indeed. The essence of Linux, right there.

    All bow down to Linus Torvalds for a great kernel! That I can do! :)

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Dan Clough@1:123/115 to Eric Renfro on Sat Jul 27 19:14:00 2019
    Eric Renfro wrote to Dan Clough <=-

    Heh. I've actually turned down working for companies, because I
    always ask one question during an interview. "Will I ever be
    required to run, operate, configure, manage, or even so much as
    touch a Windows Desktop, or Windows Server" And "Can I get an
    actual Linux oriented Workstation?" And I don't mean a PC with
    Linux on it, I mean an actual workstation. :)

    Hehe, nice, unless...... it means you don't get the job. LOL

    I mean, it does mean that I will actively turn down jobs in
    situations like that. But in my case, I can afford to be picky
    and specific. I get 5~10 offers for work every week. More during
    the prime times of January and July, where lots of companies do
    their biggest hiring hunts.

    Well that's cool. I'm assuming you're a programmer of some
    kind... (?)

    Well, yes, it doesn't have many of the flashy GUI-configgy things
    that are common nowadays, but once you know your way around it's
    just as easy. Patrick calls himself a "benevolent dictator". :-)
    As far as I know, it is *THE* oldest surviving distro today.

    Yepperding. All bow to Patrick Volkerding, supre.... Nope. Not
    me! LOL. But yes, it is one of the oldest. But then again, So is
    Debian, Red Hat Linux, and openSUSE still, runners up from
    Slackware at least. openSUSE was originally based on SLS and then
    rebased off Slackware.

    Haha, yes, I understand that thinking. But I would also argue
    that all those other distros also basically have one Head MoFo in
    Charge kinda guy too, really not much different than Slackware in
    that regard. Especially now that the big ones have become a
    commercial endeavor, pretty much.

    Indeed. The essence of Linux, right there.

    All bow down to Linus Torvalds for a great kernel! That I can do!
    :)

    No doubt about that! He's the *real* HMFIC... ;-)


    ... Windows 3.1 - From the people who brought you EDLIN.
    === MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 12:42:00 2019
    On 07-27-19 13:46, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Hmmmm... I mean, the imposed requirements of even having to have "antivirus" software specifically is pretty much degrading even the chances of having "better" in the vocabulary at all when it comes to Windows. The fact you have to have something like that constantly
    running just to prevent both infection and spreading alone...

    I have been pretty successful in the past at running Windows without antivirus.
    One just have to be careful. :)

    Focus changes, minor things, in my book. And that can always vary, even
    in Linux, based on what Desktop Environment or window-manager you use.
    :)

    Linux behaviour is more predictable, and as you say, determined by your window manager and/or desktop configuration. The type of focus shift I'm referring to is when it's uncommanded and subject to variables unrelated to the application you're working in at the time.

    On the other side, a lot of ham radio software still requires a Windoes OS. SOme will run under WINE, but not all of them will work that way.

    Hmm.. Never done HAM stuff, so I can't really comment on that. I have
    done nodal networking techniques with various things, and could digress
    to say that the difference between HAM packets and other forms of
    network packets over radio waves can definitely vary significantly. Especially in security aspects, and since it's over the air, security
    is highly important in my book.

    I think you're on a different wavelength there. Ham radio applications are many and varied these days. Some have Linux equivalents, some don't (yet). And some are multi system.

    But, my reasons for using Linux Mint are pretty much ended when
    Cinnamon started showing me ghosted taskbar items on the taskbar of
    my secondary display, and the only resolution to solving it was...

    Hmm, never had that issue at least, not yet.

    For me, it started being a real issue around Cinnamon 4.x, when it
    really started to get unstable. I've gone to using my old trusty XFCE which has never let me down. Unlike KDE, Gnome, Cinnamon, and pretty
    much everything else to date actually, in terms of DE's.

    Fair enough.


    ... C:\BELFRY is where I keep my .BAT files. ^^^oo^^^
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 12:45:00 2019
    On 07-27-19 13:54, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Heh yeah. It's funny, for me, I hated Red Hat back then. I actually had preferred Debian and actually more than that, I preferred SUSE. I think

    I never liked SUSE for some reason. Can't recall why now, but it wasn't my cup of tea.

    ultimately what I'm going to end up with is either sticking hard on Fedora, which I've actually liked since Fedora 18 and up, or with
    Xubuntu, which I hate trying to maintain packages for, and do need to
    for a small few things (SyncTERM for example)... It really depends. There's a few things I definitely really must have, and that's
    reasonably up-to-date browsers, reasonably up-to-date video driver support, moderate printer support (I currently have a semi-modern HP printer which requires a minimum version of hpcups to use it, which was not in Ubuntu 16.04), and some specific programs like zssh. Because, I like my zmodem over ssh, which I miss with not having konsole from KDE.


    Yeah the good thing about Linux is there's a lot of choice. :)

    Now, I'd mentioned SUSE, but not in current days. openSUSE has let me
    down way too much in the later years. With a lot of their dirty little hacks, like their "Druid" replacement for virt-manager's VM "Wizard", which they only fairly recently finally removed after all these years. Their default setup for open-files limit which breaks any modern
    browser today, and just.... their reliance on btrfs for things like snapshots and the ability to roll back changes, stuff that yum and dnf
    had had without filesystem level snapshots for years.

    Yeah, I tried SUSE before the OpenSUSE days, but even then I wasn't keen on it.


    ... Chuck Norris can divide by zero.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Dan Clough on Sun Jul 28 06:05:59 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Dan Clough to Eric Renfro on Sat Jul 27 2019 07:14 pm

    I mean, it does mean that I will actively turn down jobs in
    situations like that. But in my case, I can afford to be picky
    and specific. I get 5~10 offers for work every week. More during
    the prime times of January and July, where lots of companies do
    their biggest hiring hunts.

    Well that's cool. I'm assuming you're a programmer of some
    kind... (?)

    Well, sorta. I'm a Senior Linux Systems Engineer with a looooooooong proven background in my career. I'm not a developer, but I can program in various languages. Python, C++, PHP, Bash/ZSH, Perl, Ruby, etc..

    But, as a Linux engineer, I know what most of the sysctl things do. I can write custom SELinux policies, and I know how they work from EL6 up. If I had to, I could make custom SELinux policies, painfully, for other distros like Debian, but wouldn't want to since they have absolutely no base policies to start with.

    I'm a secrity expert that knows how to do what the h4xx0rs do, so I also know how to detect them, stop them, and react to them quickly. And the right tools for the job to help with that. ;)

    That sort of thing, anyway. Highly broad, yet very good at it.

    Yepperding. All bow to Patrick Volkerding, supre.... Nope. Not
    me! LOL. But yes, it is one of the oldest. But then again, So is
    Debian, Red Hat Linux, and openSUSE still, runners up from
    Slackware at least. openSUSE was originally based on SLS and then
    rebased off Slackware.

    Haha, yes, I understand that thinking. But I would also argue
    that all those other distros also basically have one Head MoFo in
    Charge kinda guy too, really not much different than Slackware in
    that regard. Especially now that the big ones have become a
    commercial endeavor, pretty much.

    Sort of yes and no.

    Debian, for one, has an elected "Head MoFo" that changes every once in a while, as do a few other distros. Commercial distros has the company heads involved, but do you think the company heads run the show? Only to a point, but look at Fedora and CentOS. They are community driven, yet people get paid to work on them and the community involvement.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 12:46:48 2019
    Hi Eric!

    25 Jul 2019 00:19, from Eric Renfro -> All:

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now,

    I use it since ~1999 on servers.
    But I only switched my main computer to it a few years ago.

    CU, Ricsi

    ... If you try cross-country skiing, start with a small country.
    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Reality is for people who can't face science fiction. (2:310/31)
  • From Adam Clark@1:153/141 to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 08:55:42 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to All on Thu Jul 25 2019 12:19 am

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use?
    I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick
    and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as
    changing distros every now and then when certain issues
    arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while, and end up liking
    or not liking depending.

    I have used Linux as primary desktop at least as far. There have been some jobs
    where I was forced to used Windows as primary at times, but personally it's never been Windows except as a 2nd boot for the occasional game or odd item that had to be run from it.

    I've been through a lot of distributions - mostly have Debian everywhere currently except one workstation which is OpenSuse. Been through Mint, Xubuntu, Ubuntu and Fedora as well, among others. It won't take me too long before I move away from OpenSuse too.
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: VA7AQD's Tavern in Kamloops, BC! - bbs.isurf.ca (1:153/141)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Sun Jul 28 13:24:36 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 2019 12:42 pm

    Hmmmm... I mean, the imposed requirements of even having to have
    "antivirus" software specifically is pretty much degrading even the
    chances of having "better" in the vocabulary at all when it comes to
    Windows. The fact you have to have something like that constantly
    running just to prevent both infection and spreading alone...

    I have been pretty successful in the past at running Windows without antivirus.
    One just have to be careful. :)

    I don't even recommend anymore, most anti-virus solutions. The only one I recommend anymore is Microsoft's, what was named "Security Essentials" before, not sure what Windows 10 renamed it to, but I recall they did rename it. Windows Defender or something?

    A lot, pretty much darn well near all, started tapping directly raw into the network layer, and interpret straight from that. Well, guess what most viruses, malware, etc focus on a lot of? Interpretters. When you ADD an interpreter to the raw sockets, you expose more direct and confrontational means to get right down to the heart of the security tools. This is unwise, especially since there's been many vulnerabilities in that front too. :)

    For me, it started being a real issue around Cinnamon 4.x,
    when it really started to get unstable. I've gone to using my old
    trusty XFCE which has never let me down. Unlike KDE, Gnome,
    Cinnamon, and pretty
    much everything else to date actually, in terms of DE's.

    Fair enough.

    Yeah. I do definitely miss some of the greatness KDE had. I don't like that Akonadi has become this monstrous beast of a thing that it probably should never have become because it's become a nightmare to maintain as it is. I mean, I even setup my mail servers to run Kolab, but now they've moved Kolab to being this commercial thing and they're stopping to maintain the GPL release packages they once did. So I'm going to eventually be tearing my mail server down and rebuilding it completely without any dependancies for the current design concepts. Build my own alternatives to some of the feastures Kolab provides, and have something I can just use and use well. It's a work in progress on that, but it'll definitely happen.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Sun Jul 28 13:29:06 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 2019 12:45 pm

    Heh yeah. It's funny, for me, I hated Red Hat back then. I actually
    had preferred Debian and actually more than that, I preferred SUSE.
    I think

    I never liked SUSE for some reason. Can't recall why now, but it wasn't my cup of tea.

    I do remember running SuSE 5.x "Shareware" heh heh heh.

    Yeah, I tried SUSE before the OpenSUSE days, but even then I wasn't keen on it.

    Well, back in the SUSE 5.0 days, there was this one annoying thing it had, which did deter me from it for a LOOOOOONG time.

    They, out of box install, setup NFS servers with exports to / by default, with a known reported vulnerability in NFS at the time.

    It literally took a week of using SUSE as a NAT server on dialup, and being connected on IRC as I usually always am (still even today!), to get a message on my consoles saying:

    "A darker side of nowhere..."

    And when I checked the process lists, there was something running: rm -rf / which had a parent pid of the NFS servers.

    It was a slow server that was running SUSE as a dialup system at the time, so the process of removing everything took a looooooong time, and by the time it wwas done, I already had a newly rebuild backup NAT/Dialup solution ready to replace it, more secure.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Richard Menedetter on Sun Jul 28 13:29:53 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Richard Menedetter to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 2019 12:46 pm

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily
    use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now,

    I use it since ~1999 on servers.
    But I only switched my main computer to it a few years ago.


    Hehe. Nice! What're you running for yourself on servers and desktop?

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Adam Clark on Sun Jul 28 13:34:11 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Adam Clark to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 2019 08:55 am

    I have used Linux as primary desktop at least as far. There have been some jobs
    where I was forced to used Windows as primary at times, but personally it's never been Windows except as a 2nd boot for the occasional game or odd item that had to be run from it.

    I've been through a lot of distributions - mostly have Debian everywhere currently except one workstation which is OpenSuse. Been through Mint, Xubuntu, Ubuntu and Fedora as well, among others. It won't take me too long before I move away from OpenSuse too.

    Yeah, a co-worker of mine uses Debian as their desktop. When my company started setting up a new L2TP style VPN, they got cooked because Debian 9 didn't have the network-manager-l2tp stuff yet. Debian 10 did, so they ended up upgrading to it sooner than later. Even then, new problems arose from that. Sigh..

    I think ultimately, I'm going to be moving everything back to Fedora. I just prefer it, and I see the way they're moving is going to allow for a bit more flexability in things with their new "modular" repository where you can choose to use specific versions of software because you're needing it, or because you're not yet ready to move up just yet, whichever the case may be.

    That, and I like being able to maintain some specific packages that I wouldn't normally find/get for Debian/Xubuntu. Things I've either already made .spec files for, or can easily. ;)

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 22:34:08 2019
    Hi Eric!

    28 Jul 2019 13:29, from Eric Renfro -> Richard Menedetter:

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their
    daily use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now,
    I use it since ~1999 on servers.
    But I only switched my main computer to it a few years ago.
    Hehe. Nice! What're you running for yourself on servers and desktop?

    Started with Redhat on the server then switched to Debian.

    On the Laptop and PC I use Ubuntu.

    CU, Ricsi

    ... There's no way to be a perfect parent but lots of ways to be a good one. --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: We are not amused. (2:310/31)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 08:55:00 2019
    On 07-28-19 13:24, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    I don't even recommend anymore, most anti-virus solutions. The only one
    I recommend anymore is Microsoft's, what was named "Security
    Essentials" before, not sure what Windows 10 renamed it to, but I
    recall they did rename it. Windows Defender or something?

    That's all I'm using, but even though Microsoft's AV solution is better integrated and works with, not in spite of Windows, it still causes some issues at times. Yes, Windows Defender is a name that cropped up at some stage.

    A lot, pretty much darn well near all, started tapping directly raw
    into the network layer, and interpret straight from that. Well, guess
    what most viruses, malware, etc focus on a lot of? Interpretters. When
    you ADD an interpreter to the raw sockets, you expose more direct and confrontational means to get right down to the heart of the security tools. This is unwise, especially since there's been many
    vulnerabilities in that front too. :)

    Yes, antivirus products have been responsible for a whole host of vulnerabilities too. At least Microsoft's products are design to work together, and haven't had to be hacked into the OS.

    Yeah. I do definitely miss some of the greatness KDE had. I don't like that Akonadi has become this monstrous beast of a thing that it
    probably should never have become because it's become a nightmare to maintain as it is. I mean, I even setup my mail servers to run Kolab,
    but now they've moved Kolab to being this commercial thing and they're stopping to maintain the GPL release packages they once did. So I'm
    going to eventually be tearing my mail server down and rebuilding it completely without any dependancies for the current design concepts.
    Build my own alternatives to some of the feastures Kolab provides, and have something I can just use and use well. It's a work in progress on that, but it'll definitely happen.

    Well, good luck, which way you end up going. :) I only run mail servers when I _really_ have to. Handling spam has turned running mail servers into a real chore. :( And there's still a lot of bad setups out there. I've got one account suffering a heap of backscatter from servers that bounce mail, instead of issue a SMTP error during the session with the spammer's system (which doesn't result in backscatter). I think the domain doesn't have any SPF records either, which doesn't help. Backscatter is something I found a solution for 15 or more years ago. There's no excuse for a mail server to generate backscatter today.


    ... Sponge cake recipe: First borrow 3 cups of flour.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 08:58:00 2019
    On 07-28-19 13:29, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Well, back in the SUSE 5.0 days, there was this one annoying thing it
    had, which did deter me from it for a LOOOOOONG time.

    I think my issues were more to do with package management, I didn't like the package management system, found it more clunky than either Yum or Apt.

    They, out of box install, setup NFS servers with exports to / by
    default, with a known reported vulnerability in NFS at the time.

    It literally took a week of using SUSE as a NAT server on dialup, and being connected on IRC as I usually always am (still even today!), to
    get a message on my consoles saying:

    "A darker side of nowhere..."

    And when I checked the process lists, there was something running: rm
    -rf / which had a parent pid of the NFS servers.

    Ouch! :-( Yeah I rarely ran NFS servers, and never exported /.


    ... I hear what you're saying but I just don't care.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Richard Menedetter on Mon Jul 29 12:33:05 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Richard Menedetter to Eric Renfro on Sun Jul 28 2019 10:34 pm

    Hehe. Nice! What're you running for yourself on servers and
    desktop?

    Started with Redhat on the server then switched to Debian.

    Nice. I honestly in some ways hated Red Hat back then. Especially when they started pushing that specific version of glibc when nobody was ready for it. After the fact, I noticed what they were doing, and agreed with it because of the results, but at the time, they broke a lot of stuff to push the community forwards. :)

    On the Laptop and PC I use Ubuntu.

    Ubuntu is a fair distro. I have a lot of personal issues with Ubuntu, but that's me. Canonical, as a company, has done a lot of things, and abandoned a lot of things as well. Just to name a few specifically: upstart, mir, unity.

    I just started throwing Fedora back on my laptop this weekend, having had run Xubuntu on there for a couple weeks, and still using Linux Mint on my desktop, but, my ultimate plan is to run either Fedora or Xubuntu on both. I'm still leaning towards Fedora, more than anything, simply because I like how it works. But, I know it can have occassional issues because of it's semi-rolling nature. With "modules" that might start to change a bit, allowing the ability to make things different, and not always update so quickly as Fedora does, but we'll see. :)

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Mon Jul 29 14:21:04 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 2019 08:55 am

    That's all I'm using, but even though Microsoft's AV solution is better integrated and works with, not in spite of Windows, it still causes some issues at times. Yes, Windows Defender is a name that cropped up at some stage.

    Yeah. I used to recommend things like Avast, Kaspersky, etc... But the ONLY one I'll recommend anymore is the Microsoft-native one. And if you know anything about Steve Gibson and Leo LaPorte, from Security Now, that's what they too recommend for Windows people.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Tue Jul 30 07:10:00 2019
    On 07-29-19 14:21, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 2019 08:55 am

    That's all I'm using, but even though Microsoft's AV solution is better integrated and works with, not in spite of Windows, it still causes some issues at times. Yes, Windows Defender is a name that cropped up at some stage.

    Yeah. I used to recommend things like Avast, Kaspersky, etc... But the ONLY one I'll recommend anymore is the Microsoft-native one. And if you know anything about Steve Gibson and Leo LaPorte, from Security Now, that's what they too recommend for Windows people.

    I'm the same, Microsoft's AV is the only one I'll consider using these days, for any on demand scanning. Third party scanners that require manual activation are still potentially useful as a second opinion, however. Manual scanning doesn't have to do all those nasty hacks into the OS.


    ... And on the 8th day God said, "Murphy, you're in charge."
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Tony Langdon on Mon Jul 29 22:19:09 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Tony Langdon to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 2019 08:58 am

    Well, back in the SUSE 5.0 days, there was this one annoying thing
    it had, which did deter me from it for a LOOOOOONG time.

    I think my issues were more to do with package management, I didn't like the package management system, found it more clunky than either Yum or Apt.

    Well, you're possibly confusing package management with repository management in that. yum, dnf, zypper, apt, apt-get, .... Are repository management tools, while the actual package management is rpm and dpkg, between those two specific ones.

    And when I checked the process lists, there was something running:
    rm -rf / which had a parent pid of the NFS servers.

    Ouch! :-( Yeah I rarely ran NFS servers, and never exported /.

    Exactly. That's why I didn't use SUSE for a loooooooooong time after that. :) ===
    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Mike Albritton@vert.synchro.net to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 21:15:47 2019
    Strictly run Linux for me. (Currently Ubuntu)
    This includes my kids' laptop for their homework stuff.
    Don't have any Microsoft stuff in my house.
    (Don't have any Apple Product in my house either.)
    ---
    $ while true
    > do
    > if Windows sucks
    > mv Windows /dev/null
    > apt-get install Linux
    > else spend $$$$$ && Buy Macinto$h
    > fi
    > done

    On 7/24/19 10:19 PM, Eric Renfro wrote:
    This echo is too quiet!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro,
    and not really distro hopping so much as changing distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while,
    and end up liking or not liking depending.

    Right now, I have a mixed setup between Xubuntu on my laptop (Mostly secondary
    computer), and Linux Mint on my primary desktop, however I'm going to be switching Mint to Xubuntu or Fedora. Still not sure.

    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.07-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)

  • From Charles Stephenson@1:226/17 to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 22:31:42 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to All on Thu Jul 25 2019 12:19 am

    This echo is too quiet!

    So who here actually uses Linux as their primary OS for their daily use? I've been doing so for over 20 years now, through thick and thin, distro to distro, and not really distro hopping so much as changing distros every now and then when certain issues arrise, or wanting to try something different for a while, and end up liking or not liking depending.

    Yeah it's quiet cuz it's summertime! :(

    I've been using linux for about the same time as you, Started out with Dual booting Red Hat and Windows XP! I Dual booted because I was 'scared' of linux, but wanted to learn it because it ran fast on a older PC that I had. I always had 'dual boot' as a backup and over the years, I found by using dual-boot I was just wasting space, because I started to NEVER use Windows! First Disto I ran without dual-boot was SuSE! I felt naked without Windows installed, even though I rarely used it! lol...

    I've been using Ubuntu for about 6-7 years now, and I'm almost 'Windows Dumb' now...hehe
    Regards,
    KrUpTiOn
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS(frontierbbs.net) - [Ohio] (1:226/17)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Eric Renfro on Tue Jul 30 20:05:00 2019
    On 07-29-19 22:19, Eric Renfro wrote to Tony Langdon <=-

    Well, you're possibly confusing package management with repository management in that. yum, dnf, zypper, apt, apt-get, .... Are repository management tools, while the actual package management is rpm and dpkg, between those two specific ones.

    Good point, but yeah I didn't like how SUSE was managed at the time.

    And when I checked the process lists, there was something running:
    rm -rf / which had a parent pid of the NFS servers.

    Ouch! :-( Yeah I rarely ran NFS servers, and never exported /.

    Exactly. That's why I didn't use SUSE for a loooooooooong time after
    that. :) ===

    Understandable!


    ... If you don't go to other people's funerals, they won't come to yours.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Eric Renfro@1:135/371 to Charles Stephenson on Thu Aug 1 01:30:51 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Charles Stephenson to Eric Renfro on Mon Jul 29 2019 10:31 pm

    I've been using linux for about the same time as you, Started out with Dual booting Red Hat and Windows XP! I Dual booted because I was 'scared' of linux, but wanted to learn it because it ran fast on a older PC that I had. I always had 'dual boot' as a backup and over the years, I found by using dual-boot I was just wasting space, because I started to NEVER use Windows! First Disto I ran without dual-boot was SuSE! I felt naked without Windows installed, even though I rarely used it! lol...

    I ran Linux on dedicated machines for the most part, myself. I'd had multiple computers rather than dual-booting.

    I've been using Ubuntu for about 6-7 years now, and I'm almost 'Windows Dumb' now...hehe

    Heh... What's Windows? Last version of Windows I even /used/, just a little bit, was Windows 7. And I got that as an "OEM" edition, Ultimate Edition, specifically, by buying a BD-RW drive, or maybe it was a DVD-RW drive, I forget which.
    ===
    )))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
    --- SBBSecho 3.08-Linux
    * Origin: Decker's Heaven -//- bbs.deckersheaven.com (1:135/371)
  • From Chicken Head to Eric Renfro on Sat Aug 3 17:34:22 2019
    Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Eric Renfro to All on Thu Jul 25 2019 12:19 am

    I've been using Linux "daily" since about...oh, 1992. Using Kernel version 0.98pl5 I think, booted up off of the old SLS distro. That was round about the time that Commodore decided to commit suicide so moving to Linux was a no-brainer (especially since I had spent a lot of time UNIX-ifying my old A2000 with ixlib ports of UNIX software anyway).

    Ah..memories.
    The AHK Gang! Live on Riot.im. When we feel like it.
  • From Kurt Weiske@1:218/700 to Chicken Head on Sun Aug 4 10:04:00 2019
    Chicken Head wrote to Eric Renfro <=-

    I've been using Linux "daily" since about...oh, 1992. Using Kernel version 0.98pl5 I think, booted up off of the old SLS distro.

    That was about the time that I started, my team had a 386/33 with 4 mb of
    RAM, recompiling the kernel to support an Intel Etherexpress/16 card took a day and a half!

    I started using BSD/OS on a mail server and later a DHCP/DNS server and
    didn't touch Linux again until 2000. It had come a long way in a short time.



    ... Have you ever seen anything like this place?
    --- MultiMail/XT v0.52
    * Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org | tomorrow's retro tech (1:218/700)
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Eric Renfro on Wed Aug 7 21:10:36 2019
    Hi Eric!

    Regarding distros.
    I used Redhat because they had a great nickname for the then current distro. (Guiness ;)

    Ubuntu was mainly chosen because it offered easy installation of Software Defined Radio modules.
    (It was easier to install than other distros.)

    I am quit OK with Fedora.
    I deeply despise SUSE.

    I never tried Mint.

    CU, Ricsi

    ... I don't have any solution, but I certainly admire the problem.
    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: The best armor is to keep out of range. (2:310/31)
  • From Tony Langdon@3:633/410 to Richard Menedetter on Thu Aug 8 12:47:00 2019
    On 08-07-19 21:10, Richard Menedetter wrote to Eric Renfro <=-

    Hi Eric!

    Regarding distros.
    I used Redhat because they had a great nickname for the then current distro. (Guiness ;)

    Ubuntu was mainly chosen because it offered easy installation of
    Software Defined Radio modules.
    (It was easier to install than other distros.)

    I am quit OK with Fedora.
    I deeply despise SUSE.

    I never tried Mint.

    My experience with more recent distros:

    CentOS I quite liked, though it's conservative in software selection.

    Fedora works well, but I found my production systems lived much longer than the rapid release cycle.

    Debian is a good choice for servers, though the NetworkManager stuff can be a bit screwy.

    Mint is a nice desktop distro, which I use.

    Lubuntu is good for minimal systems (netbooks, etc), and an old netbook with Lubuntu, SyncTerm and Multimail makes a very nice BBS terminal with great performance.

    I didn't like SuSE either, or (in its day) Mandrake/Mandriva.


    ... Bah, Humbug! Don't post 'til next year. -- Moderator Christmas greet
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.03-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (3:633/410)
  • From Jeff Smith@1:282/1031 to Richard Menedetter on Wed Aug 7 20:20:40 2019
    Hello Richard,

    Regarding distros.
    I used Redhat because they had a great nickname for the then current distro. (Guiness ;)

    I tried Redhat many years ago and recently tried CentOS which is based on RHEL.

    Yesterday I did a test install of the newest version of FreeBSD. But it failed to install due to grub install issues. Installed Ubuntu v19.04 server on the same PC without any issues.

    Ubuntu was mainly chosen because it offered easy installation of Software Defined Radio modules. (It was easier to install than other distros.)

    I would have to agree.

    I am quit OK with Fedora.
    I deeply despise SUSE.

    Haven't had an interest yet with either of the above two distros. I have recently installed and tested both Debian and as mentioned above CentOS.

    I never tried Mint.

    I am running Mint on this desktop PC as I type. Very easy to install and an easy OS for those are transitioning from a Windows PC environment.


    Jeff

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
    * Origin: Fidonet: The Ouija Board - Anoka, MN -bbs.ouijabrd.net (1:282/1031)
  • From Chicken Head to Kurt Weiske on Sat Aug 17 17:28:08 2019
    Re: Re: Linux Daily?
    By: Kurt Weiske to Chicken Head on Sun Aug 04 2019 10:04 am

    Chicken Head wrote to Eric Renfro <=-

    I've been using Linux "daily" since about...oh, 1992. Using Kernel version 0.98pl5 I think, booted up off of the old SLS distro.

    That was about the time that I started, my team had a 386/33 with 4 mb of RAM, recompiling the kernel to support an Intel Etherexpress/16 card took a day and a half!

    I started using BSD/OS on a mail server and later a DHCP/DNS server and didn't touch Linux again until 2000. It had come a long way in a short time.



    ... Have you ever seen anything like this place?

    Hah, I started using an original 386-40 from AMD. I added the 387 math co-processor specifically because xlock's screen blankers ran slow...and it was worth it!

    I remember the first WINE release in 1994 as well..it ran calc.exe. That was about it. Wine has come a long way as well.

    The AHK Gang! Live on Riot.im. When we feel like it.