• Re: Create message bases

    From Sean Dennis@1:18/200 to mark lewis on Thu Mar 25 22:14:24 2021
    mark lewis wrote to August Abolins <=-

    yes, those are bundles... the point is that doing all that is not
    really needed in today's FTN world... especially with binkp and
    mailers having the ability to compress during send in the
    same way that web servers do...

    You forget that not everyone uses BinkP and mailers to move mail,
    right? There's also some people that only poll once a day and prefer
    to get one large compressed bundle than hundreds of little PKTs.

    I seem to notice a general trend amongst Zone 1 sysops that seem to
    think that everyone uses BinkP and has a full-time Internet connection
    in the BBS world. Personally, I prefer just using FTP to move mail
    since it'd a hell of a lot simpler than BinkD.

    But I digress. This really is a topic for another echo rather than in
    GOLDED.

    -- Sean

    ... Where there's a will, there's an inheritance tax.
    ___ MultiMail/Win v0.52

    --- Maximus/2 3.01
    * Origin: Outpost BBS * bbs.outpostbbs.net:10123 (1:18/200)
  • From Marceline Jones to MARK LEWIS on Sat Mar 27 10:28:00 2021
    Re: Re: Create message bases
    By: Marceline Jones to KAI RICHTER on Tue Mar 23 2021 23:45:00


    Unzipping a PKT and viewing the *.msg file is easier.

    who, in their right minds, is archiving PKTs into bundles in this day
    in age? :smh:

    Somebody who uses oMMM.

    A packet inspector will tell me where "FF9F02C1.frG" is destined easier than manually inspecting messages or using an hex editor.

    ___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
  • From Marceline Jones to MARK LEWIS on Sat Mar 27 10:29:00 2021
    More people would use GoldED+ if it was packaged better.

    that's highly doubtful in today's world... if it were the case,
    there'd have been a lot more people talking about it and there simply
    are not and have not been, other than some sysops, since Odinn
    Sorensen passed from this realm...

    I guarantee you that more people would use it (at least 1 more).

    ___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
  • From Richard Menedetter@2:310/31 to Marceline Jones on Sat Mar 27 09:06:30 2021
    Hi Marceline!

    27 Mar 2021 10:29, from Marceline Jones -> MARK LEWIS:

    More people would use GoldED+ if it was packaged better.
    that's highly doubtful in today's world... if it were the case,
    there'd have been a lot more people talking about it and there
    simply are not and have not been, other than some sysops, since
    Odinn Sorensen passed from this realm...
    I guarantee you that more people would use it (at least 1 more).

    Probably exactly 1 more.
    This was NEVER a topic until you came around.

    Anyway we understood you do not prefer it.
    So no need to continue posting.

    CU, Ricsi

    ... When the Gods want to punish us, they give us what we want.
    --- GoldED+/LNX
    * Origin: Iraqi Bingo: B-52... F-16... M-1... F-18... F-117... (2:310/31)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12 to Marceline Jones on Sat Mar 27 08:43:31 2021
    Re: Re: Create message bases
    By: Marceline Jones to MARK LEWIS on Sat Mar 27 2021 10:28:00


    A packet inspector will tell me where "FF9F02C1.frG" is destined easier than manually inspecting messages or using an hex editor.

    that's a bundle, not a packet... depending on the mailer/tosser combination, the file name of the bundle will tell you what system it is destined for... some might use simple hex notation for the net/node while others are a
    little more complicated using 2s complement or inverse 2s complement to represent the net/node destination...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two%27s_complement


    )\/(ark
    --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)
  • From Marceline Jones to MARK LEWIS on Sun Apr 4 09:16:00 2021
    A packet inspector will tell me where "FF9F02C1.frG" is destined easier
    than manually inspecting messages or using an hex editor.
    that's a bundle, not a packet... depending on the mailer/tosser combination, the file name of the bundle will tell you what system it
    is destined for... some might use simple hex notation for the net/node while others are a little more complicated using 2s complement or
    inverse 2s complement to represent the net/node destination... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two%27s_complement

    Well I want a packet inspector so I can check messages are created and destined properly. This feature is probably out of scope because GoldED is just a message editor.

    ___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
  • From Sean Dennis@1:18/200 to Marceline Jones on Sat Apr 3 14:02:02 2021
    Marceline Jones wrote to MARK LEWIS <=-

    Well I want a packet inspector so I can check messages are
    created and destined properly. This feature is probably out
    of scope because GoldED is just a message editor.

    I've used InspectA for well over twenty years for packet inspecting
    and recommend it.

    -- Sean

    ... Where there's a will, there's an inheritance tax.
    ___ MultiMail/Win v0.52

    --- Maximus/2 3.01
    * Origin: Outpost BBS * bbs.outpostbbs.net:10123 (1:18/200)
  • From Mauro Veiga@4:801/194 to SEAN DENNIS on Tue Apr 6 10:58:00 2021
    Quoting Sean Dennis to Marceline Jones <=-

    I've used InspectA for well over twenty years for packet inspecting
    and recommend it.

    Great! Where do I find to download?


    ... File COLDBEER.CAN not found....operator not loaded!
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: Ninho do Abutre 2 - Rio de Janeiro - Brasil * (4:801/194)
  • From Sean Dennis@1:18/200 to Mauro Veiga on Tue Apr 6 14:12:06 2021
    Hello Mauro,

    Tuesday April 06 2021 10:58, you wrote to me:

    Great! Where do I find to download?

    On my BBS. Look for INSP110D.ZIP in BBS.FidoUtils; this is the DOS version.

    You will also need the "unlimited shareware" key that was released by the author to remove the shareware nag and delay. That file is I110-KEY.ZIP in BBS.Utils.

    If you have any issues, let me know.

    -- Sean

    ... Qui trop embrasse mal entreint. (Grab much, gain little.)
    --- GoldED/2 3.0.1
    * Origin: Outpost BBS * bbs.outpostbbs.net:10123 (1:18/200)
  • From Mauro Veiga@4:801/194.1 to Sean Dennis on Tue Apr 6 17:38:00 2021
    Ola Sean!

    ** 06.04.21 - 14:12, Sean Dennis wrote to Mauro Veiga:

    Hello Mauro,

    Tuesday April 06 2021 10:58, you wrote to me:

    Great! Where do I find to download?

    On my BBS. Look for INSP110D.ZIP in BBS.FidoUtils; this is the DOS version.

    You will also need the "unlimited shareware" key that was released by the author to remove the shareware nag and delay. That file is I110-KEY.ZIP in BBS.Utils.

    If you have any issues, let me know.

    Thanks, Sean! :-))

    []'s
    |
    ---------------- telnet://abutre.no-ip.org:2323 ----------- * ------
    |


    --- OpenXP 5.0.49
    * Origin: Point da Coruja - Brasil * (4:801/194.1)
  • From Kai Richter@2:240/77 to Sean Dennis on Tue Apr 6 23:30:18 2021
    Hello Sean!

    06 Apr 21, Sean Dennis wrote to Mauro Veiga:

    Look for INSP110D.ZIP in BBS.FidoUtils; this is the DOS version.

    You will also need the "unlimited shareware" key that was released by
    the author to remove the shareware nag and delay. That file is I110-KEY.ZIP in BBS.Utils.

    If you have any issues, let me know.

    Is there any reason why the key is not included with the build? Is it due to some elitist programmer contempt for non technical end users?

    More people would use InspectA if it was packaged better.
    I guarantee you that more people would use it (at least 1 more).

    Sorry, couldn't resist... >:-)

    What am i doing? This is offtopic too. If you would like to support the use of packet inspectors please go to a matching echoarea.

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.4.7
    * Origin: Monobox (2:240/77)
  • From Matthias Hertzog@2:301/101 to Kai Richter on Wed Apr 7 00:16:31 2021
    Hello Kai!

    More people would use InspectA if it was packaged better.
    I guarantee you that more people would use it (at least 1 more).

    +1 for me.

    Matthias
    --- GoldED+/W64-MSVC 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: MHS Systems (2:301/101)
  • From Vincent Coen@2:250/1 to Kai Richter on Wed Apr 7 14:26:21 2021
    Hello Kai!

    Tuesday April 06 2021 23:30, you wrote to Sean Dennis:

    Hello Sean!

    06 Apr 21, Sean Dennis wrote to Mauro Veiga:

    Look for INSP110D.ZIP in BBS.FidoUtils; this is the DOS version.

    You will also need the "unlimited shareware" key that was
    released by the author to remove the shareware nag and delay.
    That file is I110-KEY.ZIP in BBS.Utils.

    If you have any issues, let me know.

    Is there any reason why the key is not included with the build? Is it
    due to some elitist programmer contempt for non technical end users?

    More people would use InspectA if it was packaged better.
    I guarantee you that more people would use it (at least 1 more).

    Sorry, couldn't resist... >:-)

    What am i doing? This is offtopic too. If you would like to support
    the use of packet inspectors please go to a matching echoarea.

    The software is 20+ years old and likewise has been sitting on various BBS file
    systems since then.

    The file description in FILE_ID.DIZ says that it is now donate ware although on
    my system there is a file as I110-KEY.ZIP | i110-key.zip that contains an updated? HLP file along with a README file.


    Sorry most BBS sysops do not have the time to re-package s/w just because some one makes a comment regarding finding the right tool.

    That's why we have up to date lists of all files available as well as as a current newfiles list.


    Vincent

    --- Mageia Linux v7.1 X64/Mbse v1.0.7.21/GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Air Applewood, The Linux Gateway to the UK & Eire (2:250/1)
  • From Sean Dennis@1:18/200 to Kai Richter on Wed Apr 7 00:03:02 2021
    Kai Richter wrote to Sean Dennis <=-

    Is there any reason why the key is not included with the
    build? Is it due to some elitist programmer contempt for
    non technical end users?

    The author, David Nugent (who also wrote the BNU FOSSIL driver, I
    believe), was pissed that so many people used his program and never
    registered it. I have seen the original message where he told people
    off and then said he was leaving the BBS scene forever.

    This key does NOT register InspectA but only removes the shareware nag
    screen and unregistered timebomb in the program. David was very
    specific about this key. He was rather angry about the whole
    situation and that's why InspectA is technically unregisterable
    abandonware.

    What am i doing? This is offtopic too. If you would like to
    support the use of packet inspectors please go to a
    matching echoarea.

    Mauro is a user on my BBS and we'll talk shop there. However, I do
    have InspectA set up as an external program within GoldEd/2 so I can
    look at packets from within GED. InspectA opens in its own window so
    I can use GoldEd and InspectA side by side. I used to have PGP
    running years ago in GED also.

    If you want to talk about InspectA, I invite you to do so in
    BBS_CARNIVAL since I am the co-moderator there. :)

    -- Sean

    ... A PC takes the guesswork out of it. So does a bikini.
    ___ MultiMail/Win v0.52

    --- Maximus/2 3.01
    * Origin: Outpost BBS * bbs.outpostbbs.net:10123 (1:18/200)
  • From andrew clarke@3:633/267 to Sean Dennis on Thu Apr 8 19:06:50 2021
    On 2021-04-07 00:03:02, Sean Dennis (1:18/200) wrote to Kai Richter:

    The author, David Nugent (who also wrote the BNU FOSSIL driver, I believe), was pissed that so many people used his program and never registered it. I have seen the original message where he told people
    off and then said he was leaving the BBS scene forever.

    PKT inspection was always an extremely niche feature, though. The number of sysops who actually needed specialised software to look at PKTs on a regular basis would've only been in the hundreds at best. So his target audience was always going to be pretty small from the start, and it's telling that (to my knowledge) nobody's written a similar program just to do that one thing, without the file manager part. There just wasn't the demand for it.

    I'm not sure InspectA had much else going for it. As a file manager it was a bit mediocre. I suspect that was the main reason more people didn't pay for it.

    InspectA 1.1 was released in 1993. There was already competition from XTreeGold & Norton Commander, both of which were already extremely popular (and also heavily pirated!) and arguably far superior.

    But by 1997 he was fighting a losing battle on a few fronts:

    There were now stable versions of ZTreeBold & File Commander/2, both very faithful shareware OS/2 clones of XTreeGold & Norton Commander.

    The demise of FidoNet had already begun. Its peak was two years earlier. A lot of BBSes had already closed.

    There was also a big increase of free software in FidoNet. For example Maximus and Squish, which ironically David himself worked on, and both of which were later open-sourced.

    Then there was a big increase in open source FidoNet software. Msged was a good example, and was something I contributed to intermittantly between 1995-1998. It competed with the shareware version of GoldED, and ultimately probably contributed to its open-sourcing. In 2021 open source software in FidoNet is completely normal, and probably runs on the majority of FidoNet nodes.

    Outside of FidoNet the popularity of Windows 95 also signalled the demise of text-mode apps like InspectA or XTreeGold, or GoldED. They still ran under Windows 95 but often not very well, or lacked good OS integration (clipboard support, long filenames...). There was also never a 32-bit Windows version of InspectA, which I thought was a strange omission.
    --- GoldED+/BSD 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Blizzard of Ozz, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (3:633/267)
  • From Vincent Coen@2:250/1 to andrew clarke on Thu Apr 8 14:37:04 2021
    Hello andrew!

    Thursday April 08 2021 19:06, you wrote to Sean Dennis:

    On 2021-04-07 00:03:02, Sean Dennis (1:18/200) wrote to Kai Richter:

    The author, David Nugent (who also wrote the BNU FOSSIL driver, I
    believe), was pissed that so many people used his program and
    never registered it. I have seen the original message where he
    told people off and then said he was leaving the BBS scene
    forever.

    PKT inspection was always an extremely niche feature, though. The
    number of sysops who actually needed specialised software to look at
    PKTs on a regular basis would've only been in the hundreds at best. So
    his target audience was always going to be pretty small from the
    start, and it's telling that (to my knowledge) nobody's written a
    similar program just to do that one thing, without the file manager
    part. There just wasn't the demand for it.

    I'm not sure InspectA had much else going for it. As a file manager it
    was a bit mediocre. I suspect that was the main reason more people
    didn't pay for it.

    There is another tool that may well do similar - pktview that I obtained from the Husky project and this own also works under Linux.

    It will display the content of a packet that may have one or more messages.

    It is in husty-master/misc. Cannot currently find the source code for it but it is here some where as I recompiled it for Linux as x64.


    Vincent


    --- Mageia Linux v7.1 X64/Mbse v1.0.7.21/GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Air Applewood, The Linux Gateway to the UK & Eire (2:250/1)
  • From Kai Richter@2:240/77 to Sean Dennis on Thu Apr 8 14:24:04 2021
    Hello Sean!

    07 Apr 21, Sean Dennis wrote to Kai Richter:

    What am i doing? This is offtopic too.

    Mauro is a user on my BBS and we'll talk shop there.

    Thanks! I'm sorry, i expected that today any writer was following the echoarea for some time. Please start a full text search for "elitist" to find the origin of my collection of "any questions?" from "another" QWK user.

    You put up better arguments against re-packing software that have splitted distribution files. The authors rights and local copyright law.

    If you want to talk about InspectA, I invite you to do so in
    BBS_CARNIVAL

    I don't have need for a packet inspector.
    And i'm sure you don't want me there. <eg>

    Regards

    Kai

    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.4.7
    * Origin: Monobox (2:240/77)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757.2 to Vincent Coen on Thu Apr 8 14:16:57 2021
    Re: Create message bases
    By: Vincent Coen to andrew clarke on Thu Apr 08 2021 02:37 pm

    There is another tool that may well do similar - pktview that I obtained from the Husky project and this own also works under Linux.

    They can still be found around and about. pktview is a bash script and the husky project also has pktinfo. It works well.

    The Synchronet project has pktdump to look at .pkt files as well as fmsgdump to look at *.msg files. There is a windows download of pktdump on Vertrauen if anyone needs something like that.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... You can name your salary here, I call mine fred.
    --- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757.2)
  • From Vincent Coen@2:250/1 to Alan Ianson on Fri Apr 9 22:13:29 2021
    Hello Alan!

    Thursday April 08 2021 14:16, you wrote to me:

    Re: Create message bases
    By: Vincent Coen to andrew clarke on Thu Apr 08 2021 02:37 pm

    There is another tool that may well do similar - pktview that I
    obtained from the Husky project and this own also works under
    Linux.

    They can still be found around and about. pktview is a bash script and
    the husky project also has pktinfo. It works well.

    The Synchronet project has pktdump to look at .pkt files as well as
    fmsgdump to look at *.msg files. There is a windows download of
    pktdump on Vertrauen if anyone needs something like that.

    Finally found the source and it was in Soupgate sources.

    I knew I had compiled it, blasted memory :)

    If anyone needs it let me know but you will have to compile it if you are not using Linux but there again the binaries are in the Husky misc area.

    Vincent

    --- Mageia Linux v7.1 X64/Mbse v1.0.7.21/GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Air Applewood, The Linux Gateway to the UK & Eire (2:250/1)
  • From andrew clarke@3:633/267 to Vincent Coen on Sat Apr 17 15:37:10 2021
    On 2021-04-08 14:37:04, Vincent Coen (2:250/1) wrote to andrew clarke:

    I'm not sure InspectA had much else going for it. As a file manager
    it was a bit mediocre. I suspect that was the main reason more people
    didn't pay for it.

    There is another tool that may well do similar - pktview that I obtained from the Husky project and this own also works under Linux.

    It will display the content of a packet that may have one or more messages.

    I wasn't actually aware of pktview. It's a Perl 5 script that reads from stdin.

    FWIW InspectA allowed you to delete individual messages from packets, which obviously isn't something pktview can do. Though we're getting into very niche territory there.

    It is in husty-master/misc. Cannot currently find the source code for
    it but it is here some where as I recompiled it for Linux as x64.

    https://github.com/huskyproject/hpt/blob/master/misc/pktview

    or https://raw.githubusercontent.com/huskyproject/hpt/master/misc/pktview

    --- GoldED+/BSD 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Blizzard of Ozz, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (3:633/267)
  • From andrew clarke@3:633/267 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 17 15:57:47 2021
    On 2021-04-08 14:16:56, Alan Ianson (1:153/757.2) wrote to Vincent Coen:

    There is another tool that may well do similar - pktview that I
    obtained from the Husky project and this own also works under
    Linux.

    They can still be found around and about. pktview is a bash script and
    the husky project also has pktinfo. It works well.

    FWIW pktview is a Perl script.

    WRT pktinfo, I worked on C code recently and made some improvements, but its weakness is it heavily relies on HPT's packet parsing functions. A broken packet will tend to make pktinfo abort execution (like HPT would) instead of just displaying what information it can. There's not really an easy way I can fix that without potentially breaking something in HPT, so it will have to do.

    --- GoldED+/BSD 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Blizzard of Ozz, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (3:633/267)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757.2 to andrew clarke on Sat Apr 17 12:01:50 2021
    Re: Create message bases
    By: andrew clarke to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 17 2021 03:57 pm

    FWIW pktview is a Perl script.

    Yes, now that I take a closer look it is.

    WRT pktinfo, I worked on C code recently and made some improvements, but its weakness is it heavily relies on HPT's packet parsing functions. A broken packet will tend to make pktinfo abort execution (like HPT would) instead of just displaying what information it can. There's not really an easy way I can fix that without potentially breaking something in HPT, so it will have to do.

    pktinfo has never failed me so far so I hope I will never get packets that are so broken.

    I haven't looked at pktview in a long time but I can't seem to get it to read a packet currently. How does one use pktview?

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... Always listen to experts, hear the impossible, then do it.
    --- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757.2)
  • From Michael Dukelsky@2:5020/1042 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 17 22:11:38 2021
    Hello Alan,

    Saturday April 17 2021, Alan Ianson wrote to andrew clarke:

    I haven't looked at pktview in a long time but I can't seem to get it
    to read a packet currently. How does one use pktview?

    # This script reads PKT from stdin and prints it's contents in human-readabe form into stdout
    # options:
    # -v verbose
    # -s print SEEN-BY, PATH and PTH kludges
    # -r print RFC-* kludges
    # -p print PID and TID kludges
    # -h print usage information

    pktview -vsrp < 6034b1c0.pkt

    Michael

    ... node (at) f1042 (dot) ru
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Moscow, Russia (2:5020/1042)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757.2 to Michael Dukelsky on Sat Apr 17 12:41:44 2021
    Re: Create message bases
    By: Michael Dukelsky to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 17 2021 10:11 pm

    # This script reads PKT from stdin and prints it's contents in human-readabe form into stdout
    # options:
    # -v verbose
    # -s print SEEN-BY, PATH and PTH kludges
    # -r print RFC-* kludges
    # -p print PID and TID kludges
    # -h print usage information

    pktview -vsrp < 6034b1c0.pkt

    Thank you. I was missing a < on my command line.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... The worst thing about censorship is ██████████.
    --- SBBSecho 3.14-Linux
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757.2)
  • From andrew clarke@3:633/267 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 18 15:12:20 2021
    On 2021-04-17 12:01:50, Alan Ianson (1:153/757.2) wrote to andrew clarke:

    I haven't looked at pktview in a long time but I can't seem to get it
    to read a packet currently. How does one use pktview?

    cat filename.pkt | ./pktview

    or

    ./pktview < filename.pkt

    Functionally there is no difference between the above commands but the first is easier to read left-to-right.

    --- GoldED+/BSD 1.1.5-b20180707
    * Origin: Blizzard of Ozz, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (3:633/267)
  • From Benny Pedersen@2:230/0 to Oli on Wed Sep 29 22:39:22 2021
    Hello Oli!

    15 Mar 2021 11:51, Oli wrote to Kai Richter:

    Kai wrote (2021-03-14):

    I know how open source works.
    The typical mentality is "you're on your own".

    True, because that is the main purpose of open source, to give YOU the
    possibilty to do it on your own.

    open source bullshit bingo

    playing golf with the president :)


    Regards Benny

    ... too late to die young :)

    --- Msged/LNX 6.1.2 (Linux/5.14.8-gentoo-dist (x86_64))
    * Origin: gopher://fido.junc.eu/ (2:230/0)