Hi Deaon,

Tresting Talsiman on linux/m68k and getting this error on the
talsiman/postie end.
2022-04-14 14:36:55 [1893] DEBUG: Starting Tosser
2022-04-14 14:36:55 [1893] ERROR: Packet version != 2

Hub is husky.
1 14:36:15 Start tossing...
A 14:36:15 Invalid pkt version 512!

An endian issue?

I was reading a gated newsgroup, that was talking about that in cpu's.

The intresting thing is that hpt on the same machine works, but it can't
read the squish files.

Hpt on the same machine, can read & process JAM files though...

I think Apam, didn't think someone would do what I've been playing around
with though.



\/orlon
aka - Stephen




--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

Re: Talsiman/Postie
By: vorlon to deon on Sun Apr 17 2022 05:37 pm

talsiman/postie end.
2022-04-14 14:36:55 [1893] ERROR: Packet version != 2
Hub is husky.
A 14:36:15 Invalid pkt version 512!

An endian issue?

The intresting thing is that hpt on the same machine works, but it can't read the squish files.

Hpt on the same machine, can read & process JAM files though...

So that sounds even more like an endian issue.

I'm assuming you compiled hpt and talisman on the m68k? I bet the hpt on the same machine sending something to a different machine wouldnt work... You'd get the same pkt version issue... (Send me a packet and we can see...)

"512" is the 2nd bit of the 2nd byte, and "2" is the 2nd bit of the 1st byte, and in a fido packet, the "version" value is a 2 byte field.


...δεσ∩
--- SBBSecho 3.15-Linux
* Origin: I'm playing with ANSI+videotex - wanna play too? (21:2/116)

Hi Deon,

The intresting thing is that hpt on the same machine works, but
it can't read the squish files.

Hpt on the same machine, can read & process JAM files though...

So that sounds even more like an endian issue.

I'm assuming you compiled hpt and talisman on the m68k? I bet the
hpt on the same machine sending something to a different machine
wouldnt work... You'd get the same pkt version issue... (Send me a
packet and we can see...)

Yes, both got compiled on this machine that I'm on now. Linux Debian 11
M68K. The hub is the fido hub, running husky on intel Debian 11 64bit.

I thought of using hpt with Talisman, (hpt was already compiled) but even
a fresh blank msg base hpt complained it could'nt read the squish mail
files.






\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

Re: RE: Talsiman/Postie
By: vorlon to deon on Mon Apr 18 2022 10:46 am

Yes, both got compiled on this machine that I'm on now. Linux Debian 11 M68K. The hub is the fido hub, running husky on intel Debian 11 64bit.

I thought of using hpt with Talisman, (hpt was already compiled) but even
a fresh blank msg base hpt complained it could'nt read the squish mail files.

hpt on m68k couldnt read "new" squish mail files (that it created)? Or you they were created (and populated) on the Intel and moved over?

The later could also be endian related...


...δεσ∩
--- SBBSecho 3.15-Linux
* Origin: I'm playing with ANSI+videotex - wanna play too? (21:2/116)

Re: RE: Talsiman/Postie
By: vorlon to deon on Mon Apr 18 2022 10:46 am

Yes, both got compiled on this machine that I'm on now. Linux
Debian 11 M68K. The hub is the fido hub, running husky on intel

Debian 11 64bit. I thought of using hpt with Talisman, (hpt was
already compiled) but even a fresh blank msg base hpt complained
it could'nt read the squish mail files.

hpt on m68k couldnt read "new" squish mail files (that it created)?
Or you they were created (and populated) on the Intel and moved
over?

I think things are getting confussed. Everything was compiled on the
m68k, with only config files copied for a starting place.

The message base files got created by the respective program.

Hpt/Magicka = Work (Jam message base)
Hpt/Talsiman = Not Work (Squish message base)
Talsiman/Postie = Work, but the hub/postie reject the packets as bad.
(Squish message base)

Hpt can't read squish filse created by Talsiman/Postie.
Talsiman/Postie can't read squish files created with hpt.

Talisman dosn't support JAM message bases. That's how I found the Squish message base issue above, as hpt supports squish. But not in this configuration.






\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

Re: RE: Talsiman/Postie
By: vorlon to deon on Tue Apr 19 2022 02:50 pm

I think things are getting confussed. Everything was compiled on the
m68k, with only config files copied for a starting place.

Yeah I did get that. I just wanted to confirm that you didnt lift the squish (or jam) files from intel and was trying to read them from hpt compile on m68k.

The message base files got created by the respective program.

Got it.

Hpt/Magicka = Work (Jam message base)
Hpt/Talsiman = Not Work (Squish message base)
Talsiman/Postie = Work, but the hub/postie reject the packets as bad. (Squish message base)

Hpt can't read squish filse created by Talsiman/Postie.
Talsiman/Postie can't read squish files created with hpt.

Talisman dosn't support JAM message bases. That's how I found the Squish message base issue above, as hpt supports squish. But not in this configuration.

I was trying to understand this:

hpt(m68k) generates a packet and is read OK by hpt(intel) (or some other mail tosser I guess...)?

can hpt(m68k) read it's own squish files OK?

I think this will help to confirm whether endianness is an issue.

I'm not sure what "Not Work" means (for Squish) - I dont recall if you described that error you were seeing. Not sure if there is a "debug mode" that might help..?

Talisman/Postie rejecting the packet (as well as not reading the squish mail files) could still be an endian issue (the error you provided when opening a packet certainly fits that description), even if the answer to the first question is yes. Apam should jump in and comment, but it seems he's not around...


...δεσ∩
--- SBBSecho 3.15-Linux
* Origin: I'm playing with ANSI+videotex - wanna play too? (21:2/116)

Hpt/Magicka = Work (Jam message base)
Hpt/Talsiman = Not Work (Squish message base)
Talsiman/Postie = Work, but the hub/postie reject the packets as bad.
(Squish message base)

Hpt can't read squish filse created by Talsiman/Postie.
Talsiman/Postie can't read squish files created with hpt.

Talisman dosn't support JAM message bases. That's how I found the
Squish message base issue above, as hpt supports squish. But not in
this configuration.

I was trying to understand this:

hpt(m68k) generates a packet and is read OK by hpt(intel) (or some
other mail tosser I guess...)?

Yes. The messages that came from Magicka/Hpt (This point) pass through the net633 ftn hub, that's running HPT (Intel).

can hpt(m68k) read it's own squish files OK?

Yes. This message is using the squish message base created by hpt. I compiled the msged editor to make sure it was doing that.

I'm not sure what "Not Work" means (for Squish) - I dont recall if you described that error you were seeing. Not sure if there is a "debug
mode" that might help..?

Talisman can only read/write squish message bases.

Talisman/Postie rejecting the packet (as well as not reading the
squish mail files)

Talisman/postie only can't read the squish mail files if they are created with hpt & vice versa.

Talisman/Postie can read write them ok, but then the packet is rejected at the hub.

could still be an endian issue (the error you provided when opening a packet certainly fits that
description), even if the answer to the first question is yes.
Apam should jump in and comment, but it seems he's not around...

Until Apam show's up, we wont know.

--- msged/lnx 6.3 2022-02-08
* Origin: Vorlon Empire: Sector 550 (21:1/195.1@fsxnet)

HI Daon.

Did you see the fidonet netmail I sent you with the two zip files?





\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

Re: RE: Talsiman/Postie
By: vorlon to deon on Sat Apr 23 2022 12:09 am

HI Daon.

Did you see the fidonet netmail I sent you with the two zip files?

Howdy, I got it. Didnt look at the files yet.

(I normally access the BBS with iTerm, that doesnt support zmodem - but I'm just firing up Syncterm now.)

...

Yup, I reckon it is endian related:
hpt (works, shows this):

00000000 c3 00 c3 00 e6 07 03 00 12 00 0a 00 2f 00 0e 00 |o?=.o?=.o?=......./...|
00000010 00 00 02 00 01 00 01 00 ff 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 |........o?=.......|
00000020 00 00 15 00 15 00 00 00 00 01 10 09 01 00 15 00 |................| 00000030 15 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 02 00 c3 00 c3 00 |............o?=.o?=.|

postie (didnt work) shows this:

00000000 00 c3 00 c3 07 e6 00 03 00 0e 00 11 00 0e 00 31 |.o?=.o?=.o?=.........1|
00000010 00 00 00 02 ff ff 00 01 fe 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 |....o?=o?=..o?=.......|
00000020 00 00 00 15 00 15 00 01 01 00 00 00 00 01 00 15 |................| 00000030 00 15 00 01 00 00 45 54 53 50 00 02 00 c3 00 c3 |......ETSP...o?=.o?=|

The first 4 bytes are the from and to address and they are reversed. The next few bytes are year, month, date and they too are reversed.

Is there a compile option to change endianess?


...δεσ∩
--- SBBSecho 3.15-Linux
* Origin: I'm playing with ANSI+videotex - wanna play too? (21:2/116)

Until Apam show's up, we wont know.

Talisman / Postie doesn't do big endian. There's no byte swapping happening, which is why you're saw what you saw. I could add it I suppose, but I it's not really a priority.

Andrew

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Until Apam show's up, we wont know.

Talisman / Postie doesn't do big endian. There's no byte swapping happening, which is why you're saw what you saw. I could add it I
suppose, but I it's not really a priority.

Let me first say I'm not a programmer...

Looking through the Magicka source (I've moved all the data files to the
data directory), I see that Magicka does do a byte-swap command. Is that
the only thing that needs to happen or is it more in-depth?




\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

Looking through the Magicka source (I've moved all the data files to the data directory), I see that Magicka does do a byte-swap command. Is that the only thing that needs to happen or is it more in-depth?

Packets / squish message bases are in little endian format, so they work as is on little endian computers. So basically, for big endian, every time you read a multibyte number from a packet or message base you need to swap the bytes around to suit the cpu. So having a byte swap command is important, but you also need to find all the places that read / write data and have a check for cpu type and swap bytes.

It's not hard to do, just time consuming, ideally I would have thought about it when writing the tosser / bbs and added it then.

I can look at adding it in, but I don't have a big endian computer to test it on, so would likely need some help to determine if i've found all the places that need byte swapping.

Andrew

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

It's not hard to do, just time consuming, ideally I would have
thought about it when writing the tosser / bbs and added it then.

That's ok. I bet you never thought that someone would spin up a system on
such old hardware. #-)

I can look at adding it in, but I don't have a big endian computer
to test it on, so would likely need some help to determine if i've
found all the places that need byte swapping.

There's a couple of options.

1: I give you ssh access. I have both real hardware and emulated setup's.

Real: 68040@40Mhz, 132Mb of Ram
Emu: 68040@1.2Ghz, 1Gb of Ram

2: You spin up a emulated setup.

https://wiki.debian.org/M68k/QemuSystemM68k

Use this iso though, as it's the latest. Then it's just a matter of
updating the install like any debian linux system.

https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/ports/current/debian-11.0.0-m68k-NETINS T-1.iso









\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)

That's ok. I bet you never thought that someone would spin up a system on such old hardware. #-)

Nah, I think I was just focused on making it portable to windows this time, and didn't think about anything other than windows and linux.

I've spun up a qemu-m68k vm here, and done some work in a branch called "bigendian"

There should be enough to get it going with husky now, but I haven't tested that.

There's a lot more to do, for example, QWK and Bluewave probably wont work, QWK networking, WWIV networking and Postie probably wont work, binki might, but i'm not sure on that.

the squish code is shared amoungst the different programs so that side of thing should work, it mostly just interfacing with various packet formats now.

if you want to try it out / follow what i'm doing just issue 'git checkout bigendian' after doing a clone and that will set you on the branch.

Andrew

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

There's a lot more to do, for example, QWK and Bluewave probably wont

Actually QWK / QWK net should work I think, as it's all stored in bytes. bluewave i've just done a fix that should make it work properly (the endian stuff was already there, but I think the detection was off)

Andrew

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Everything should now be working in the bigendian branch.

I'll merge it soon. You should be good to go for m68k now.

Andrew

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

That's ok. I bet you never thought that someone would spin up
a system on such old hardware. #-)

Nah, I think I was just focused on making it portable to windows
this time, and didn't think about anything other than windows and
linux.

Well the Amiga 3000 is running Linux, just not not on intel/amd hardware.

I've spun up a qemu-m68k vm here, and done some work in a branch
called "bigendian"

[...]

if you want to try it out / follow what i'm doing just issue 'git
checkout bigendian' after doing a clone and that will set you on
the branch.

Wow! I guess we know what you got upto on sunday/monday. I see you've now released .40.. I'll grab that and do a compile, and test...




\/orlon



--- MagickaBBS v0.15alpha (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire (21:1/195.1)