• Dead NAS...

    From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to All on Wed Sep 11 20:56:00 2024
    We had a power cut, and when I turned on my NAS, no NAS.

    My NAS is a Synology DS1010+, modded to think it's a DS1511+ and running
    DSM 6.2. The LAN lights and power lights blink, but no drive lights, and
    it doesn't respond to SSH, ping, or Synology assistant.

    I'm hoping, if I can't revive it, to buy another 5-drive chassis and
    move the drive pool into it - it looks like that might be possible.

    Otherwise, any suggestions as to what's a decent, inexpensive NAS to
    support 12-14TB? I don't need containers or an app ecosystem, although
    it'd be nice. NFS, SMB and DLNA, mostly.



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  • From Gamgee@21:2/138 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 07:53:00 2024
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to All <=-

    Otherwise, any suggestions as to what's a decent, inexpensive NAS to support 12-14TB? I don't need containers or an app ecosystem, although it'd be nice. NFS, SMB and DLNA, mostly.

    I don't know enough about this to offer a meaningful recommendation, but
    I do know enough to believe that the terms "decent" and "inexpensive"
    are mutually exclusive on this topic. ;-)


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Gamgee on Thu Sep 12 06:35:00 2024
    Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I don't know enough about this to offer a meaningful recommendation,
    but I do know enough to believe that the terms "decent" and
    "inexpensive" are mutually exclusive on this topic. ;-)

    I bought this one for $100 at a thrift shop; got about 5 years out of
    it, it was 5+ years old when I bought it.

    I am going to plug in a VGA monitor into it and try reseating everything
    and testing the power supply, I think that's about all I can do at this
    point.



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  • From Bucko@21:4/131 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 18:34:19 2024
    On 11 Sep 2024, poindexter FORTRAN said the following...

    We had a power cut, and when I turned on my NAS, no NAS.

    My NAS is a Synology DS1010+, modded to think it's a DS1511+ and running DSM 6.2. The LAN lights and power lights blink, but no drive lights, and it doesn't respond to SSH, ping, or Synology assistant.

    I'm hoping, if I can't revive it, to buy another 5-drive chassis and
    move the drive pool into it - it looks like that might be possible.

    Otherwise, any suggestions as to what's a decent, inexpensive NAS to support 12-14TB? I don't need containers or an app ecosystem, although it'd be nice. NFS, SMB and DLNA, mostly.



    You should be able to just put the drives in the new model and they will rebuild with the new OS..

    As for a cheap NAS, I run Xpenology on a old Surveillance Computer I installed Proxmox,then set up a Xpenology VM with ARC Auxxilian boot loader, I run the latest Synology 7.2.1 OS on it, and it runs quicker then my real DS-920+ You can run Xpenology on even an old PC, I had it running on a i3, 3.4ghz with 32gigs of RAM, and about 10 TB's in assorted HD's. This is all if you want to stay with Synology, otherwise, TrueNAS is the next best thing, I am waiting for my son to give me an extra Terramaster 6 bay NAS he has and I am going to install TrueNAS on it to handle my BBS VLAN which is set up as a DMZ on my home network. I will more then likely remove the Xpenology NAS at that time..

    I know I rambled a bit but I hope you can get something worthwhile out of my response..


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  • From Gamgee@21:2/138 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 17:35:00 2024
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-

    I don't know enough about this to offer a meaningful recommendation,
    but I do know enough to believe that the terms "decent" and
    "inexpensive" are mutually exclusive on this topic. ;-)

    I bought this one for $100 at a thrift shop; got about 5 years out of
    it, it was 5+ years old when I bought it.

    Well then, that's not too bad at all.

    I am going to plug in a VGA monitor into it and try reseating
    everything and testing the power supply, I think that's about all I can
    do at this point.

    Yup, those sound like good ideas. Good luck.



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  • From paulie420@21:2/150 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 20:44:41 2024
    We had a power cut, and when I turned on my NAS, no NAS.

    Oh no, pF - we had talked about yer Synology earlier and you mentioned you thought it was long in the tooth. UGH!

    I'm hoping, if I can't revive it, to buy another 5-drive chassis and
    move the drive pool into it - it looks like that might be possible.

    Since you mentioned 5-drive chassis', I really like the Jonsbo N1 case. I'd wanted to build in it but didn't... it receives 5 3.5" HDDs, any SFX PSU and an ITX mobo.

    -----
    Jonsbo N1 NAS Chassic 5 3.5" HDD 1 2.5" SSD Aluminum Alloy ITX Motherboard SFX PSU Low Profile Graphics Data Server $140-259
    ----- https://www.amazon.com/N1-Mini-ITX-Chassis-Computer-Aluminum/dp/B09WZLHCZG

    Its so darned cute and would make a rock solid TrueNAS machine...



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  • From deon@21:2/116 to paulie420 on Fri Sep 13 17:11:28 2024
    Re: Re: Dead NAS...
    By: paulie420 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 2024 08:44 pm

    Howdy,

    Since you mentioned 5-drive chassis', I really like the Jonsbo N1 case. I'd wanted to build in it but didn't... it receives 5 3.5" HDDs, any SFX PSU and an ITX mobo.

    So I looked at this a little while ago.

    I wanted small form factor, which it looks like it provides (dont need the hot swap that a normal nas provides), but I couldnt make the numbers work.

    It would have been cheaper than a QNAP/Synology, but not by much (from this side of the world anyway)... Shipping charges killed it, especially the Jonsbo from China.

    So I went a QNAP 664 (it was on sale at Amazon at the time), and still run TrueNAS on it... :)


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to paulie420 on Fri Sep 13 06:46:00 2024
    paulie420 wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    We had a power cut, and when I turned on my NAS, no NAS.

    Oh no, pF - we had talked about yer Synology earlier and you mentioned
    you thought it was long in the tooth. UGH!

    I'm hoping, if I can't revive it, to buy another 5-drive chassis and
    move the drive pool into it - it looks like that might be possible.

    Since you mentioned 5-drive chassis', I really like the Jonsbo N1 case. I'd wanted to build in it but didn't... it receives 5 3.5" HDDs, any
    SFX PSU and an ITX mobo.

    I ended up buying a Synology DS1522+ - a dual core Ryzen with 8gb
    instead of my atom with 2GB. I should be able to put my 5 5.25" drives
    into it and recreate the drive pool.

    Two thoughts - my office is quiet without the NAS running, I hope the
    new version is quieter! Secondly, if it goes on sale on Prime day in
    October I'm going to be pissed!



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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Sep 13 20:07:00 2024
    Hello pF!

    I ended up buying a Synology DS1522+ - a dual core Ryzen with 8gb
    instead of my atom with 2GB. I should be able to put my 5 5.25" drives into it and recreate the drive pool.

    Two thoughts - my office is quiet without the NAS running, I hope the
    new version is quieter! Secondly, if it goes on sale on Prime day in October I'm going to be pissed!

    If quiet is a priority, wouldn't SSDs solve the problem for a
    NAS? M.2 drives, I think they're called.




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  • From Bucko@21:4/131 to Ogg on Fri Sep 13 21:38:56 2024
    On 13 Sep 2024, Ogg said the following...


    Two thoughts - my office is quiet without the NAS running, I hope the new version is quieter! Secondly, if it goes on sale on Prime day in October I'm going to be pissed!

    If quiet is a priority, wouldn't SSDs solve the problem for a
    NAS? M.2 drives, I think they're called.


    Terramaster just came out with a 9bay nVME NAS unit or I should say are about to come out with it. My son has one that he will be doing a video on soon. He is waiting for the nVME's to arrive.


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  • From paulie420@21:2/150 to deon on Fri Sep 13 19:16:56 2024
    I wanted small form factor, which it looks like it provides (dont need
    the hot swap that a normal nas provides), but I couldnt make the numbers work.

    It would have been cheaper than a QNAP/Synology, but not by much (from this side of the world anyway)... Shipping charges killed it, especially the Jonsbo from China.

    So I went a QNAP 664 (it was on sale at Amazon at the time), and still
    run TrueNAS on it... :)

    Right - you'd mentioned a 5 drive array, so I didn't suggest what I think still makes for a good TrueNAS-only machine - a Dell r320. They are only $50, the CPU can be upgraded to the max 20-thread 10-core for under $30 and DDR3 RAM is pennies - but maybe for you a Dell r720 (or 720xd) might work. 8/12 HDD bays and the same cheap upgrade routes - I don't know what they cost, but I assume 30-40% of the r730 $800 price. Could be a solution...

    I *love* the Dell Poweredge platform as its enterprise, bulletproof and iDRAC kicks butt. With TrueNAS Electric Eel offering new ZFS single-drive expansions, it might be a fit. While in beta now, the release is coming and allows you to expand ZFS arrays 1 drive at a time. Its the route I'm planning on taking - and hopefully they'll expand functionality to include changing from a ZFS-1 to ZFS-2/3... [But that functionality ISN'T there yet.]



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  • From paulie420@21:2/150 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Sep 13 19:18:03 2024
    I ended up buying a Synology DS1522+ - a dual core Ryzen with 8gb
    instead of my atom with 2GB. I should be able to put my 5 5.25" drives into it and recreate the drive pool.

    Two thoughts - my office is quiet without the NAS running, I hope the
    new version is quieter! Secondly, if it goes on sale on Prime day in October I'm going to be pissed!

    Ahhhh - in the last post I didn't realize that you already jumped on a replacement. Got it. I've heard great things about Synology and will check out that model.

    Software-side Synology is supposed to be top notch. Will you be using it, or another option like TrueNAS??



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  • From neoshock@21:1/150 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Sep 13 23:32:39 2024
    Otherwise, any suggestions as to what's a decent, inexpensive NAS to support 12-14TB? I don't need containers or an app ecosystem, although it'd be nice. NFS, SMB and DLNA, mostly.

    Hi Poindextor,
    I am not sure what filesystem Synology uses, but if its something like zfs then it would be easy to import into a NAS you can build.

    My NAS/Homelab is built from just my older computer parts, and I was able to pick up a 9 bay drive computer case for $12 at my local Freegeek.

    If you are unable to fix your issue, you may want to look at just building your own with old computer parts. My NAS is just running with 8GB of RAM on Proxmox, and I have been using it for almost ten years I believe.

    If you do have a FreeGeek in your area it may be worth looking at that route.

    Lloyd (neoshock) sysop @ Vintage Pi BBS
    vintagepi.asuscomm.com

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  • From Arelor@21:2/138 to Gamgee on Mon Sep 16 18:52:04 2024
    Re: Re: Dead NAS...
    By: Gamgee to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Sep 12 2024 07:53 am

    I don't know enough about this to offer a meaningful recommendation, but
    I do know enough to believe that the terms "decent" and "inexpensive"
    are mutually exclusive on this topic. ;-)


    As far as canned solutions go, I have to agree. An out-of-the-box commercial solution for storage is quite expensive.

    I have seen some NAS boxes aimed at tiny businesses with good manuals and tons of features starting at 450 bucks, drives not included. I can't vouch for them because I have never tried them. My boss has one of those at home. I might ask him tomorrow.

    For moderate use I think finding a second hand server and stuffing it with drives is a better idea. It takes a whole lot of room in comparison, but it is also easier to support past EOL and you can use it for more things than a NAS appliance.


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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to Arelor on Mon Sep 16 23:39:00 2024
    Hello Arelor!

    As far as canned solutions go, I have to agree. An out-of-
    the-box commercial solution for storage is quite expensive.

    I have seen some NAS boxes aimed at tiny businesses with
    good manuals and tons of features starting at 450 bucks,
    drives not included. I can't vouch for them because I have
    never tried them. My boss has one of those at home. I might
    ask him tomorrow.

    There are quite a few under $500 *with* the disks included at
    the 'zon.

    This one looks good, but it doesn't seem clear if the disks are
    included.

    https://www.amazon.ca/Synology-DiskStation-II-QuadCore- 2xGigabit/dp/B01EG1RLBY

    ( ..although I've heard that Synology machines are hard to use
    with one's own choice of software)

    These with disks included look good too:


    https://www.amazon.ca/BUFFALO-LinkStation-Private-Included-LS220D1202/dp/B08DZS265Q/


    https://www.amazon.ca/BUFFALO-LinkStation-Private-Included-LS220D1202/dp/B08V5L1X1C/


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Ogg on Tue Sep 17 07:18:00 2024
    Ogg wrote to Arelor <=-

    As far as canned solutions go, I have to agree. An out-of-
    the-box commercial solution for storage is quite expensive.

    You're paying for convenience and features. And, they're buying lock-in
    with their features and convenience.

    I picked up a Synology NAS a couple of years ago for around $100. It
    was long in the tooth by the time I got it. I had a handful of 2TB
    drives laying around from an older machine that had a mirror array,
    plus a couple of external drives I'd used for backup. Put them in the
    drive and worked for a couple of years.

    The chassis died recently, and I could have built a new system from
    scratch and used TrueNAS, but instead I had some gift cards burning a
    hole in my pocket and I bought a new chassis. Put the drives in, booted
    it up, it recognized the drives, all of the settings, and the array and
    I was back in business in about 10 minutes.

    I have seen some NAS boxes aimed at tiny businesses with
    good manuals and tons of features starting at 450 bucks,
    drives not included. I can't vouch for them because I have
    never tried them. My boss has one of those at home. I might
    ask him tomorrow.

    I started out consulting setting up businesses with Microsoft Small
    Business Server; with a Synology NAS, out of the box, you could set up
    AV scanning, file sharing, mail, chat, calendaring and a bunch of other
    tools.

    Unfortunately, nowadays, I think you'd be better off with Google
    Workspace, but if you wanted to keep your data off grid, this would be attractive.

    This one looks good, but it doesn't seem clear if the disks are
    included.

    https://www.amazon.ca/Synology-DiskStation-II-QuadCore- 2xGigabit/dp/B01EG1RLBY

    Based on the price, I'm guessing no drives.

    ( ..although I've heard that Synology machines are hard to use
    with one's own choice of software)

    I've not seen anything like that, but without more info I couldn't
    comment.

    These with disks included look good too:


    https://www.amazon.ca/BUFFALO-LinkStation-Private-Included-LS220D1202/dp /B08DZS265Q/


    https://www.amazon.ca/BUFFALO-LinkStation-Private-Included-LS220D1202/dp /B08V5L1X1C/

    Bear in mind that with those Buffalo systems (and other 2-bay systems with drives) they are two drive systems, the 12TB system is probably 2x6TB.
    You'd want to mirror the drives to provide redundancy, but that halves
    the effective space.

    I do like Buffalo - they used to include a "friendly" version of DD-WRT
    on their routers instead of developing their own firmware, and made it
    easy to flash the full version on them. I used them for a small office
    network back in the 2010s.




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  • From Arelor@21:2/138 to Ogg on Wed Sep 18 15:55:59 2024
    Re: Dead NAS...
    By: Ogg to Arelor on Mon Sep 16 2024 11:39 pm

    There are quite a few under $500 *with* the disks included at
    the 'zon.


    Yeah, but the question there is whether they can compete with the other ones.

    I doubt the synology you linked has drives included. Besides, that is a 2 bay model and I was thinking of 4+ bays models. I have a bunch of 2 bay NAS units myself but none of them costed more than 100 bucks each. They were old crappy EOLed units when bought, but you get the idea.

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    I have an old Bufflo LinkStation which is supposedly a superior unit to the LS220 you linked. It is fine for a budget unit but you are going to bring it to its knees if you try to apply heavy load on it. I use it for storing backups.


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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to Arelor on Wed Sep 18 18:54:00 2024
    Hello Arelor!

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that
    Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    You're the 2nd person that has mentioned such a thing to me.
    So.. it's best to stay away from Synology boxes if the hope is
    to install DIY NAS software?


    I have an old Bufflo LinkStation which is supposedly a
    superior unit to the LS220 you linked. It is fine for a
    budget unit but you are going to bring it to its knees if
    you try to apply heavy load on it. I use it for storing
    backups.

    A two-bay would be good enough for me to start with. And 4TB
    (2 x 8TB, RAID 1) would be plenty. I too primarily just need
    to store clone-images and basic backups.


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  • From Arelor@21:2/138 to Ogg on Thu Sep 19 03:57:46 2024
    Re: Dead NAS...
    By: Ogg to Arelor on Wed Sep 18 2024 06:54 pm

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that
    Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    You're the 2nd person that has mentioned such a thing to me.
    So.. it's best to stay away from Synology boxes if the hope is
    to install DIY NAS software?

    I am only mentioning what I have heard. I don't have hands-on experience with Synology.

    If your hope is to install your own NAS software then I guess it is because you are after specfic features, at which point I am sure you will be better off building your own machine from parts.

    If you are still running on a low budget but want some custom NAS software, I think the Asustor NAS manufacturer goes as far as publishing tutorials for replacing the factory firmware with third-party Operating Systems. Bonus points because the hardware is competitively priced.

    Personally, I think if you are buying low end you can't justify the time it takes to replace the factory OS.

    A two-bay would be good enough for me to start with. And 4TB
    (2 x 8TB, RAID 1) would be plenty. I too primarily just need
    to store clone-images and basic backups.

    Most people would be fine with that, but keep in mind a NAS is more than two drives in an enclosure. They have a CPU, network card and RAM memory. If those aren't strong enough you can overpower the machine if you abuse it.

    My Link Station 500 (on paper, more powerful than the LS220 you linked) is quite fine on regular use. Then one day you need to upload 3TB of data in small files using a script and FTP. It will take 4 days for such a NAS to accept and store all that many files because the hardware can't take them faster, and I have seen the machine drop connections because it became resource starved.

    Which is fine, because it is a low budget model from 2015.

    I mean, if you plan to upload and download a couple of files every now and then, a low specs Buffalo is perfectly fine. Still, if you are going the cheapo road I find D-Link's DNS-320L is a bit more reliable under heavy load and last time I checked it had a comparable price.

    None of these models I am discussing are still supported. Ensure they are not Internet reachable. I place all this stuff in isolated VLANs so they don't get to talk to the Internet directly.


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Arelor on Thu Sep 19 07:15:00 2024
    Arelor wrote to Ogg <=-

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    I don't know if I'd go that far. They are starting to want to shut down
    third party drive support in favor of their enterprise-class drives, but
    that's easily remediated.

    (Although, I'm using old desktop drives and all of them came up as "supported" under the new chassis I bought.)

    Synology has their own ecosystem of apps, like storage, video sharing, collaboration, chat and a mail server - but also support third party
    F/OSS apps (I'm looking through the list and I see Transmission,
    RabbitMQ, SyncThing, Home Assistant, Git and others.)



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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Ogg on Thu Sep 19 07:19:00 2024
    Ogg wrote to Arelor <=-

    Hello Arelor!

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that
    Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    You're the 2nd person that has mentioned such a thing to me.
    So.. it's best to stay away from Synology boxes if the hope is
    to install DIY NAS software?

    In that case, yes. You can't easily just install another NAS OS on the
    hardware without tweaking the boot environment. It's possible, but I
    haven't tried it and the instructions looked daunting.




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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Arelor on Thu Sep 19 07:26:00 2024
    Arelor wrote to Ogg <=-

    If your hope is to install your own NAS software then I guess it is because you are after specfic features, at which point I am sure you
    will be better off building your own machine from parts.

    One machine I like a lot that looks cheap in the used market is the HP
    Proliant MicroServer - some of the older ones are cheap, they have AMD
    CPUs and a couple of easily-accessible drive bays.

    A two-bay would be good enough for me to start with. And 4TB
    (2 x 8TB, RAID 1) would be plenty. I too primarily just need
    to store clone-images and basic backups.

    An off-lease business PC with two drive bays might do the trick? Some of
    the Dell Optiplex 90X0 systems come with RAID on the motherboard,
    otherwise PCI-x RAID SATA cards are pretty cheap.



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  • From Bucko@21:4/131 to Ogg on Thu Sep 19 18:48:21 2024
    On 18 Sep 2024, Ogg said the following...

    Hello Arelor!

    I can't talk about the Synology. Word in the street is that
    Synology is the Apple of the NAS world.

    You're the 2nd person that has mentioned such a thing to me.
    So.. it's best to stay away from Synology boxes if the hope is
    to install DIY NAS software?


    I have an old Bufflo LinkStation which is supposedly a
    superior unit to the LS220 you linked. It is fine for a
    budget unit but you are going to bring it to its knees if
    you try to apply heavy load on it. I use it for storing
    backups.

    A two-bay would be good enough for me to start with. And 4TB
    (2 x 8TB, RAID 1) would be plenty. I too primarily just need
    to store clone-images and basic backups.



    I love Synology, my opinion is they have the best OS that runs a NAS, their OS is a bit tough to change to something else, and as someone mentioned they are moving towards making you use their enterprise HD's. My opinion is if you want to be able to use any HD, be able to change the OS to something else, then Terramaster, and UGreen are the way to go. I own a Synology, and a Terramaster 2 Bay which I will soon be getting a 4bay unit. The Terramaster to change the OS was as simple as opening it up pulling out a USB thumbdrive, installing a new one.What I did was install a 512TB nVME drive pulled the thumbdrive, put proxmox on a new thumbdrive, booted from it, and installed Proxmox on the nVME drive. Upon bootup after that I installed Xpenology in Proxmox, the great thing about this method is you can install anything you want testing different OS' until you decide which one you want to run. I ran TrueNAS for about a week, I ran Unraid, Open Media Vault, all at the same time actually. I finally settled on Xpenology until I got a retired Surveilance machine which had a better Hardware setup. I will soon retire that machine and move over to the 4Bay Terramaster.

    Sorry for rambling.

    Gonna plug my Synology Fanboy son here if you are interested in NAS software, hardware etc. check out my son's Youtube channel, Wundertech, and on the web www.wundertech.net he has a lot of useful info on his website and his video's explain a lot also...


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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to Bucko on Fri Sep 20 00:55:00 2024
    Hello Bucko!

    Sorry for rambling.

    It is interesting to read about what other people settle with
    and why.


    Gonna plug my Synology Fanboy son here if you are interested in NAS software, hardware etc. check out my son's Youtube channel, Wundertech,
    and on the web www.wundertech.net he has a lot of useful info on his website and his video's explain a lot also...

    Yup.. quite a plug! :D But that's ok. I don't really need
    10GbE networking. My interest is just to have a good place to
    confidently dump backups on a regular basis and to store large
    media files. I don't need a NAS to "serve" multimedia.

    Interesting comment about ECC memory.


    --- OpenXP 5.0.58
    * Origin: (} Pointy McPointFace (21:4/106.21)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Bucko on Fri Sep 20 06:57:00 2024
    Bucko wrote to Ogg <=-

    I love Synology, my opinion is they have the best OS that runs a NAS, their OS is a bit tough to change to something else, and as someone mentioned they are moving towards making you use their enterprise HD's.
    My opinion is if you want to be able to use any HD, be able to change
    the OS to something else, then Terramaster, and UGreen are the way to
    go.

    There is a way to add most drives to the whitelist on Synology.
    Surprising that all of my Seagate and WD desktop 2TB drives are
    recognized and supported in the newest DSM. Some of those drives are 5+
    years old!


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